Home FAQ Search Memberlist User Groups Register Login   

BloggingTories.ca Forum IndexBloggingTories.ca Forum Index
    Index     FAQ     Search     Register     Login         JOIN THE DISCUSSION - CLICK HERE      


Goto page Previous  1, 2  

Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 2 of 2
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
RCO





Joined: 02 Mar 2009
Posts: 9439
Reputation: 307.1Reputation: 307.1
votes: 3
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thinking about this some more , perhaps the liberal mp's realise the so called " change " vote propelled them to many unexpected victories in 2015 . and now there worried that same vote might instead go against them in 2019 .


those looking for change aren't going to go liberal in 2019 , they haven't delivered much change and are about as maintain the status quo , party you could find


it might indicate to me the cpc can have more success if there able to successfully label the liberals an old tired party , sure this government has only been in power since 2015 but its basically a carbon copy of the liberal government we had from 1993-2005 and a lot of the high profile mp's are long time liberals , like Ralph Goodale and Scott Brison . these aren't fresh faces , they've been around for years
Bugs





Joined: 16 Dec 2009
Posts: 6206
Reputation: 295.2
votes: 8

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My suspicion is that the best the Liberals can realistically hope for is to head up a minority government. They seem clumsy at contriving their pseudo-events, but the opposition leadership -- both parties -- is so feckless and confused that they have room to turn things around.

I don't know how anyone could have less impact -- at least on the positive side -- than Jagmeet, but Andrew has done it. The traces he will leave in the sand will be to have given Trudeau his best chance by splitting his party. People have to understand -- a loss of even a small percentage of votes can shift the election in another direction. If Max gets active, he can certainly do that.

The coalitions are changing in Quebec, but they do not change in Engish-speaking Canada because we Anglos have no forum. The debate is carried on with whispers and knowing glances. There is no place to go, and our leaders put the interests of the dairy cartel above those of the nation.

But Bernier has to get active in English-speaking Canada.
cosmostein





Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 8119
Reputation: 325Reputation: 325
votes: 21
Location: The World

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New Brunswick is a complication situation as the Liberals were pretty far ahead in the popular vote, however if the Liberals are likely to lose seats anywhere in Atlantic Canada that is the likely target.

Ontario is going to be an interesting situation;
While the PC's won a massive majority there was a lot of negativity toward the former Premier. Good governance and a common sense approach to spending could go a long way with the PCs assisting any gains in Ontario Federally.

Also all those campaign photos of Premier Wynne and Trudeau in 2015 will likely be utilized come election time.

Quebec is always a unique political animal;
They turned on the ADQ fast last time around and while there is a desire for change within the Province the CAQ is going to have to do somethings that are very popular and very quickly to maintain the momentum.

I agree with Bugs generally idea that a grand gesture needs to be made to Quebec, likely an Economic one with benefits to the nation as a whole.

I like Energy East, but I am open.
Bugs





Joined: 16 Dec 2009
Posts: 6206
Reputation: 295.2
votes: 8

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think we are in a lot of danger. Here's the thing ... what we who have been stigmatized as "right wingers" too casually fall into lumping our opponents into one category, of "the Left". But the Left has always been a coalition of groups, many of them government-funded. It has now entirely changed its nature.

Open your mind to this: when I first got interested in politics, my first attachment was to the CCF. They were middle-class people who claimed to be looking out for the common man, both industrial workers and farmers. When they became the NDP, they ditched the farmers, along with the Waffle. But the NDP turned into a boomer party rather than a British Labour Party for Canada, and took up discrimination and racism, along with 'quotas'.

Now their problem is that they haven't yet found a place in the new ideological realm on the left. One leg of the NDP stool is the labour unions, and they have gone as far as they can, but they have the money and trained personnel to run an organization, and they mostly run the NDP. They have sold out their involuntary membership, but they can't go full Social Justice without giving up some of their hold on the party.

It's the Liberals who have become the Social Justice party.

Social justice is different because it acts to stymie politics. It makes its advances through the Courts, often based on arguments involving 'equality'. This is where many of the tensions in contemporary society come from. Our youth are an 'effect' of these policies -- blame the parents all you want, it isn't ALL their fault.

Example: when the Ford government scraps the sex-ed program, a group starts an action in court,

Quote:
Ontario’s Human Rights Commission joining sex-ed legal challenge
By Shawn Jeffords, The Canadian Press — Oct 9 2018

TORONTO — An interim sexual-education curriculum introduced by Ontario's Progressive Conservative government discriminates against some students and puts them at greater risk of sexual violence, the province's human rights commission said Tuesday as it joined a legal challenge of the document.

The interim curriculum, which replaces a modernized version drafted by the previous Liberal government in 2015, discriminates based on sex, sexual orientation, gender identity and gender expression, the commission said.

"The children most affected by the changes to the education curriculum are the same children who are at the highest risk of exclusion, harassment and violence," Chief Commissioner Renu Mandhane said in a statement.

"This is not the safe, welcoming education experience envisioned in the Human Rights Code. We stand with students across Ontario who are using their voice to make sure all students' human rights are respected."

Six students' families filed a complaint with the Human Rights Tribunal of Ontario in August, claiming the interim curriculum makes no mention of issues such as gender diversity or the rights of LGBTQ students.

Their lawyers argued that the government's decision to repeal the modernized curriculum violates the province's human rights code and should be declared unlawful. The lead applicant in the case is an 11-year-old transgender student.

The 2015 sex-ed curriculum included warnings about online bullying and sexting, but opponents, especially social conservatives, objected to the parts of the plan addressing same-sex marriage, gender identity and masturbation.

Repealing the modernized curriculum was one of Premier Doug Ford's key campaign promises, and one of the first things he did after taking office this summer. [....]
https://www.nationalnewswatch.com/2018/10/09/ontarios-human-rights-commission-joining-sex-ed-legal-challenge/#.W7zxpGhKjIV


This is an example. I am not attracting your attention to the sex-ed part of this, rather to how 11 families can be recruited and the courts used to block the government of 13 million people.

That's how Social Justice works ... through Human Rights Commissions and the like, as well as the courts. Do I have to go through the similarities of these tribunals to Star Chamber?

That is what has to be opposed from the other side. The NDP (so far) have nothing to say aboult it, as far as I can see. I expect them to be big losers, even in Anglo-Canada. But the Conservative Party, led by Scheer, can't deal with this. They join in me-too-ing it, like a spaniel wanting to be petted.

It seems to me that we have to create an awareness of how social justice works, and how, despite the glittering virtue implied in its naming of itself, it works for negative ends.
queenmandy85





Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 344
Reputation: 110.1
votes: 2
Location: Saskatoon

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, Bugs, how do you go about defending the LGBTQ community. I read Barbara Ameil's book and I agree that the HRC has produced unintended consequences.
On your main point, you have given up on the Grits, the CPC and the NDP. How are you going to get the 175 seats campaigning on your issues to achieve your goals? Can you convince enough doners to give you the millions of dollars of THEIR money to enable you to convince 40% of the electorate that you are right?
queenmandy85





Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 344
Reputation: 110.1
votes: 2
Location: Saskatoon

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RCO, you say Scott Brison is a "long time Liberal?" It isn't that long ago he was running for the Progressive Conservative leadership.
Bugs





Joined: 16 Dec 2009
Posts: 6206
Reputation: 295.2
votes: 8

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why can't the LGBTQWERTY community is doing quite nicely on its own. Nobody is attacking them. As far as mainstream society is concerned, it doesn't want to know. Which means, there's no sex in the public space. For anybody, even lovesick teenagers.

This group has lots of cultural and social power. You don't have to worry about them, nobody (save a few very very very very marginal groups) is attacking homosexuals. This is one of the most tolerant societies on earth. Homosexuals are using the schools to give them an even more tolerant ... supply of sweet young boys, confused about whether they're punched or bored. What did Colonel Saunders used to say? Mmmm-mmmm good!

The Human Rights isn't "protecting" anybody. They attack elements of the population to make them comply with standards that are imposed, and they do it very much for the benefit of groups selected on the basis of race, culture, religion, and gender. Everything is wrong with it. They use state power to impose financial penalties on people (and deprive them of their charter rights) in an effort to change social practices. There is no way, in the precedent-setting cases, that the accused could have known (s)he was committing a transgression when (s)he committed the act.

When a Sihk comes into a Canadian Legion hall, why do his customs prevail of those of our veterans? That's the perversity at the heart of this kind of thinking. It's taken to be a racial barrier, but is it? Why is the turban on better than the turban off? Taking off your hat has long been a sign of respect, in this case, the veteran's respect for dead comrades. The Sikh's have an I don't take off my turban off for anybody! attitude.

It isn't that anybody's "right". It's that one group has state power on its side.

What these organizations don't understand is that these things used to be negotiated on the ground. Maybe if a Sikh and a Presbyterian want to have a beer together, they have to go to the place around the corner. It's just a culture clash, it doesn't have to get anybody raw knuckles. (Besides, those kinds of fights are like hockey fights. A minute later, both of them are too winded to continue.)

Think on this: the way the Human Rights guys do it produces resentment. And that's the stuff that they are supposed to be eliminating. And this will only grow.
RCO





Joined: 02 Mar 2009
Posts: 9439
Reputation: 307.1Reputation: 307.1
votes: 3
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

queenmandy85 wrote:
RCO, you say Scott Brison is a "long time Liberal?" It isn't that long ago he was running for the Progressive Conservative leadership.



Scott Brison has been a liberal mp since 2004 , that is a long time in my opinion


true there is other liberal mp's who've been in Ottawa longer , PEI has 2 , Lawrence Macaulay ( first elected 1988 ) and Wayne Easter ( first elected 1993 )


my point is , the current government is made up of the same bunch of people who were involved with the liberals prior to the conservatives taking over in 2006


there is really nothing new about this government , its old and stale , but claims to be new as they came back to power in 2015
queenmandy85





Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 344
Reputation: 110.1
votes: 2
Location: Saskatoon

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I asked Bugs: "On your main point, you have given up on the Grits, the CPC and the NDP. How are you going to get the 175 seats campaigning on your issues to achieve your goals? Can you convince enough doners to give you the millions of dollars of THEIR money to enable you to convince 40% of the electorate that you are right?

I pateintly await your answer. :-)
Toronto Centre





Joined: 12 Feb 2011
Posts: 1290
Reputation: 122.9
votes: 4
Location: Toronto

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bugs wrote:

Homosexuals are using the schools to give them an even more tolerant ... supply of sweet young boys,

Not true at all, but dont let me stop you from fantasizing and broadcasting your wishes.

You do need to come out of the closet.

Quote:

When a Sihk <sic>comes into a Canadian Legion hall, why do his customs prevail of those of our veterans? That's the perversity at the heart of this kind of thinking. It's taken to be a racial barrier, but is it? Why is the turban on better than the turban off?

Here ya go...answer this. I dare you.

" When a Jew comes into a Canadian Legion hall, why do his customs prevail of those of our veterans? That's the perversity at the heart of this kind of thinking. It's taken to be a racial barrier, but is it? Why is the Yarmulke on better than the Yarmulke off? "



Quote:

Taking off your hat has long been a sign of respect, in this case, the veteran's respect for dead comrades.

Yeah? Where ?
Quote:
The Jews have an I don't take off my Yarmulke off for anybody! attitude.

Why do you dislike Jews so much ? Ya know...and Sikh's ?
Quote:

It isn't that anybody's "right". It's that one group has state power on its side.

Oh? And which group are we talking about? The Jews or the Sikh's or the other number of folks who can wear a hat in a Legion Hall ? You do know most members have never been in the military....oh wait,. I doubt you do considering the amount of made up bullshit you've posted here so far.

Quote:

Think on this: the way the Human Rights guys do it produces resentment.

Correct... The Court system has been somewhat alleviated by pesky not quite criminal issues tying them up and The Courts are mad about this. Ok...they arent but its fun watching you try and make a point and failing miserably.
Toronto Centre





Joined: 12 Feb 2011
Posts: 1290
Reputation: 122.9
votes: 4
Location: Toronto

PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 6:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

queenmandy85 wrote:


I pateintly await your answer. :-)

How much time have you ?
Bugs





Joined: 16 Dec 2009
Posts: 6206
Reputation: 295.2
votes: 8

PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

queenmandy85 wrote:
I asked Bugs: "On your main point, you have given up on the Grits, the CPC and the NDP. How are you going to get the 175 seats campaigning on your issues to achieve your goals? Can you convince enough doners to give you the millions of dollars of THEIR money to enable you to convince 40% of the electorate that you are right?

I pateintly await your answer. :-)


It isn't up to me to run a campaign. You want me to sketch out of road to power in two years or to roll over and admit defeat. I understand what you mean.

I start from where I am. In the next election, my issues are (1) to get rid of the loonies presently screwing up the country, (2) to restore the role of law, and oust the so-called Human Rights gulag, and (3) to stop the green energy stupidity.

There is no party that represents me on the last two issues. Agree?

The only remaining priority I have in the election is to see the present crowd out, but Justin is taking care of that on his own. And Scheer is not very capable, and you know ... the dweeb factor. Only the lemmings will follow him if there's an alternative to him.

So I support Bernier. I think, given the weak showing of the putative leader of the CPC. the likeliest outcome is a minority government. In that situation, Bernier makes sense even if he only compels the other parties to respond to issues.

What else am I supposed to do?

Look at how quickly parties that take on these popular but denied issues come to the fore in Europe, and how Trump has done the same in the USA. Whatever reason you have for having contempt for him, he has brought immigration, and later, political correctness, into focus. Look at the issues that destroy leadership -- from Kavanaugh to Patrick Brown -- and are shaping the politics of the 21st century.

It's all about gender and race, and organizing discrimination against white males. And none of that is allowed to be talked about in Canada. You can be called a racist just for raising the subject in a critical vein. Believing lying is gendered, for instance, is not something that can be questioned. Only men lie.

Don't think I am the only one out here that feels like this -- many people do, but they are intimidated. When people find out how many people are like me, they will see new possibility, and beyond the present limits.

Is your answer better? You never reveal your deep commitments, other than lap-dog loyalty to the Glorious Leader. But what are your goals for politics? Do you have any? Are they well served by the member that is supposed to represent you?

Quote:
... Bernier launched his new party in September, unveiling the name and announcing he’d be setting up headquarters in Gatineau, Que. This followed a late-August defection from the Conservative Party of Canada.

Since then, Bernier says he’s raised more than $350,000 and has amassed 22,000 "founding members." "It's going very well," he said, adding that he has a goal of raising more than $3.5 million before the next election.
https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/maxime-bernier-registers-people-s-party-with-elections-canada-1.4127997
queenmandy85





Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 344
Reputation: 110.1
votes: 2
Location: Saskatoon

PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you. That is an excellent response. If you get out and campaign hard for Mr. Bernier, and you can get others out as well, he will benifit.
You are more fortunate than me. My party went extinct when it merged with Reform. I guess I am a free agent. I am not wholly impressed by the PM or Mr. Sheer although I believe he would be a more competant PM.
My lap dog loyalty is to Queen Elizabeth II. My core value is loyalty to the Monarch. If I have given the impression you are a voice in the wilderness, try being a militant Monarchist. :-)
I agree immigration is a problem, but for different reasons. For me, it is a matter of numbers. I believe we have far too many people in Canada.
I agree with you on the issue of the Human Rights Commission.
I have to correct you on President Trump. I have always tried to show respect to his office and to him personally. As a foreigner, it is not my place to do otherwise. I do disagree with many of his policies but it would be inappropriate to hold him in contempt. I believe he was unprepared for the position but I am impressed by his intuitive political skill.
Again, thank you for your response. My patience was rewarded.
Bugs





Joined: 16 Dec 2009
Posts: 6206
Reputation: 295.2
votes: 8

PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for a thoughtful reply.

It's a pleasure when folks thrash out some objections that leads to a nice exchange.

I'm like you in that I would support Scheer if he was out there, fighting the nonsense in an effective way. It isn't as if Harper had my priorities. I supported him because it seemed to have a logic, and it amounted to a lot of incremental change in policies that improved them. And I would support Scheer again, if he quit going along with the other side so much.
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 2 of 2

Goto page Previous  1, 2  


 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Liberal losses in NB, Quebec, Ontario? Strategic thoughts

phpBBCopyright 2001, 2005 phpBB