Home FAQ Search Memberlist User Groups Register Login   

BloggingTories.ca Forum IndexBloggingTories.ca Forum Index
    Index     FAQ     Search     Register     Login         JOIN THE DISCUSSION - CLICK HERE      

*NEW* Login or register using your Facebook account.

Not a member? Join the fastest growing conservative community!
Membership is free and takes 15 seconds


CLICK HERE or use Facebook to login or register ----> Connect



Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30  Next  

Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 26 of 30
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Progressive Tory





Joined: 04 Dec 2010
Posts: 743
Reputation: 66.2
votes: 1

PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cosmostein wrote:
Bugs wrote:
Am I wrong??? If nobody wants to run against Justin, wouldn't that be just one more indication that the Liberal Party of Canada is a zombie party ... walking around, stirring (perhaps) the ashes, looking for memories, for red meat to get their teeth into ... but the animating spirit long departed.


My first thought was that no one wants to run in a race they will lose;
My second thought was that that no one wants to be the leader who has to rebuild this party;

Then I sat back and thought to myself;
Who else really is there?

If I gave Liberals the option to give me their "Liberal Leadership All-stars"

Who would be running?


Within caucus two of their biggest all-stars are running.

Justin might have been better suited for party president then leader though.
cosmostein





Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 6438
Reputation: 246.9
votes: 21
Location: The World

PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Progressive Tory wrote:
cosmostein wrote:
Bugs wrote:
Am I wrong??? If nobody wants to run against Justin, wouldn't that be just one more indication that the Liberal Party of Canada is a zombie party ... walking around, stirring (perhaps) the ashes, looking for memories, for red meat to get their teeth into ... but the animating spirit long departed.


My first thought was that no one wants to run in a race they will lose;
My second thought was that that no one wants to be the leader who has to rebuild this party;

Then I sat back and thought to myself;
Who else really is there?

If I gave Liberals the option to give me their "Liberal Leadership All-stars"

Who would be running?


Within caucus two of their biggest all-stars are running.

Justin might have been better suited for party president then leader though.


Lets not limit ourselves to the caucus;
Lets only limit ourselves by our imagination :D

You could pick 4x candidates who are Liberal (or close enough in Doer case) who are they and why didn't they run?
Progressive Tory





Joined: 04 Dec 2010
Posts: 743
Reputation: 66.2
votes: 1

PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmmmm..
John Manley
Frank McKenna
Dalton McGuinty
Robert Ghiz(?)

Not many good Liberals left anymore. Another though is Jean Marc Fournier, but he has little name recognition. I think the four I mentioned would have the biggest profiles, though I don't necessarily think they'd be best for the Liberals.

As for why they didn't run... I think the first three all missed their opportunity. Manley and McKenna would have been good in 2006, I don't think they ran then because the party was in shambles and scandal plagued. I also don't think McKenna is interested in public life again and both are making to much money to enter politics. Manley is more influential now then he would be as leader if the third party. Manley probably couldn't beat Trudeau either.

I think Dalton's time was in 2008, his record then as premier was fairly good. Since then his premiership has gone down hill. He probably gave Trudeau a good fight but could he have beaten him? As well he probably knows he couldn't become PM with his track record.

Robert Ghiz, who's popularity in PEI has been sinking, would have made a strong candidate this time. I think his reasons are personal. He was just re-elected and has young kids with another on the way. And again could he beat Trudeau?

The other candidate I had forgot about was Mark Carney, obviously a big star. I saw on TV last week that he had supposedly given it a lot of thought but that he probably couldn't beat Trudeau. Nobody in their right mind would leave the BOC to be defeated by Trudeau.

So it all comes back to Trudeau I think. Some have a lot more to lose my being defeated.
Progressive Tory





Joined: 04 Dec 2010
Posts: 743
Reputation: 66.2
votes: 1

PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One less candidate, no-name Alex Burton couldn't raise any money.

http://www.vancouversun.com/ne.....story.html
cosmostein





Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 6438
Reputation: 246.9
votes: 21
Location: The World

PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Progressive Tory wrote:
Hmmmm..
John Manley
Frank McKenna
Dalton McGuinty
Robert Ghiz(?)

Not many good Liberals left anymore. Another though is Jean Marc Fournier, but he has little name recognition. I think the four I mentioned would have the biggest profiles, though I don't necessarily think they'd be best for the Liberals.

As for why they didn't run... I think the first three all missed their opportunity. Manley and McKenna would have been good in 2006, I don't think they ran then because the party was in shambles and scandal plagued. I also don't think McKenna is interested in public life again and both are making to much money to enter politics. Manley is more influential now then he would be as leader if the third party. Manley probably couldn't beat Trudeau either.

I think Dalton's time was in 2008, his record then as premier was fairly good. Since then his premiership has gone down hill. He probably gave Trudeau a good fight but could he have beaten him? As well he probably knows he couldn't become PM with his track record.

Robert Ghiz, who's popularity in PEI has been sinking, would have made a strong candidate this time. I think his reasons are personal. He was just re-elected and has young kids with another on the way. And again could he beat Trudeau?

The other candidate I had forgot about was Mark Carney, obviously a big star. I saw on TV last week that he had supposedly given it a lot of thought but that he probably couldn't beat Trudeau. Nobody in their right mind would leave the BOC to be defeated by Trudeau.

So it all comes back to Trudeau I think. Some have a lot more to lose my being defeated.


I basically had the same list;
And came to generally the same conclusions, too old, too old, record, too young.

The thing is; any of those guys from a practical standpoint are better actual options than JT.

The fact that this race is JT's to lose really says a lot about sizzle over substance;
Bugs





Joined: 16 Dec 2009
Posts: 2388
Reputation: 165.3Reputation: 165.3
votes: 6

PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My reaction ... has the Liberal Party of Canada actually lost its gravitas to the degree that Trudeau is such a favourite? That seems positively decadent to me, given Trudeau fils lack of any real track record.

Maybe 'adolescent' would be a better way of describing it.

No matter what the media thinks, the people of Canada can't possibly let such a politically childish group take over the government of the country.
cosmostein





Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 6438
Reputation: 246.9
votes: 21
Location: The World

PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bugs wrote:
My reaction ... has the Liberal Party of Canada actually lost its gravitas to the degree that Trudeau is such a favourite? That seems positively decadent to me, given Trudeau fils lack of any real track record.

Maybe 'adolescent' would be a better way of describing it.

No matter what the media thinks, the people of Canada can't possibly let such a politically childish group take over the government of the country.


I think the fact that JT is so far ahead is a mature realization by the LPC.

Harper baring any major blunders is basically Margaret Thatcher;
Very polarizing, doing a good enough job to secure enough support to keep winning, never wins by an overwhelming margin, never strays too far from core support.

Harper is the steady hand;

Electing JT leader tells me that Mulcair and the NDP are the target in 2015.
More specifically Quebec.

The Liberals aren't going to the mat on the "big issues" they just want 100 seats so that in 2019 if Harper has step down they have a shot to secure something respectable west of Quebec.

Most of the polls we see with Trudeau as leader of the LPC show massive swings of support in Quebec and Atlantic Canada, but not exactly lighting the world on fire west of there.

This is before he has opened his mouth on a significant issue, or been properly "vetted".

Trudeau is the easiest path to 90 - 100 seats, however beyond that you need to out Harper Harper and thats proving a little more complicated then most thought.
Progressive Tory





Joined: 04 Dec 2010
Posts: 743
Reputation: 66.2
votes: 1

PostPosted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I have read Trudeau has a very strong team behind him, as well could possibly do very well in BC too.

He's a very big contrast from both Mulcair and Harper which could be a big plus for him.
Progressive Tory





Joined: 04 Dec 2010
Posts: 743
Reputation: 66.2
votes: 1

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So Martin Cauchon will be soon entering the race.. Don't know what kind of factor he will be but it should be interesting to see.
cosmostein





Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 6438
Reputation: 246.9
votes: 21
Location: The World

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Progressive Tory wrote:
From what I have read Trudeau has a very strong team behind him, as well could possibly do very well in BC too.

He's a very big contrast from both Mulcair and Harper which could be a big plus for him.


BC is a huge uphill climb;
For a while the LPC was trailing the GPC, and I am a fan of the LPC making a surge out there because that votes comes almost 1:1 from the NDP allowing the CPC to maintain Urban ridings.

I agree with the Contrast; the problem is that I am not sure if he is a contrast that appeals to the votes you need to take away from Harper;

JT battles for the 60% that didn't vote CPC in 2011, I am not entire convinced he has appeal in the regions that the LPC need to win to governed (IE the 905's, Northern Ontario, etc)
Progressive Tory





Joined: 04 Dec 2010
Posts: 743
Reputation: 66.2
votes: 1

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One poll had him at 40% in BC I beleive.
cosmostein





Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 6438
Reputation: 246.9
votes: 21
Location: The World

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Progressive Tory wrote:
One poll had him at 40% in BC I beleive.


I will chalk that up to "lets see how it goes", as I recall during the lead-up to the NDP leadership race Mulcair found himself statistically tied with Harper in Ontario.

The LPC secured 13% in 2011, granted that's pretty low as they did secure 19 in 2008, but the reality is their highwater mark over the last few decades has been 28.6%, I find it highly unlikely in a Province outside of Quebec we see a nearly 30% increase in popular vote once the new shine wears off.

While urban BC is very much Liberal; and some small pockets elsewhere a solid 40% remains firmly Conservative, with like 10 - 20% above that somewhere in the some "red tory" range, unless JT can completely absorb the NDP vote in BC I would say the 40% is optimistic and within the context of a leadership race which always provides some "interesting " polling.
cosmostein





Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 6438
Reputation: 246.9
votes: 21
Location: The World

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Martin Cauchon enters race at last minute;

Quote:
Former cabinet minister Martin Cauchon is making a late entry into the already crowded federal Liberal leadership race.

Cauchon submitted his nomination papers and $75,000 entry fee just hours before the party's registration deadline of midnight Sunday.

Assuming everything is in order and is verified by the party in the next day or two, Cauchon will become the ninth candidate seeking to lead the once-mighty party out of the political wilderness.


http://www.cbc.ca/news/politic.....-race.html
cosmostein





Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 6438
Reputation: 246.9
votes: 21
Location: The World

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The best part about Cauchon is that Outremont (Mulcair's riding) is his former riding.

Left on Left battle royale is exactly what I want to see leading up to 2015.
Bugs





Joined: 16 Dec 2009
Posts: 2388
Reputation: 165.3Reputation: 165.3
votes: 6

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cosmostein wrote:

I think the fact that JT is so far ahead is a mature realization by the LPC.

Harper baring any major blunders is basically Margaret Thatcher;
Very polarizing, doing a good enough job to secure enough support to keep winning, never wins by an overwhelming margin, never strays too far from core support.

Harper is the steady hand;


I know it's a quibble, but I think it's time conservatives stopped using media memes when analysing their political situation. Harper isn't in any way a Margaret Thatcher type. I don't mean to degrade him, but Machiavelli has a point. Harper makes his changes in small increments, without comment. Where Maggie was all sharp edges and in-your-face rhetoric raising the ideological temperature, Harper is like Fabreeze ... rather than sharp edges, a kind of pragmatic ooze that follows the Bill Davis model ... "Bland works" ... he famously said, no doubt drawing deeply on his pipe and looking thoughtful.

Harper quietly changes the scent in the room, if he can, and stays out of the picture. He pays the price to stay in power. He knows the media are the enemy, and when he does appear, it is likely in a full interview by Mansbridge, or some serious professional. The impression Harper actually gives off is that of a somewhat shy guy, a 'technocrat' in the Canadian WASP mold. He avoids the eclat of politics, but when he does appear, he is direct and more forthright than most political leaders. And he is very decent in all aspects of his life.

Where do we get off, repeating this 'narrative' of the 'cold' PM, the bully, the dirty fighter ... whose original sin goes back to his refusal to provide 'material' for the 'narrators' of the media world? What's that based on, other than Kinsella's drawing board?

This Harper guy seems OK to a lot of people. They think he's a good manager, and he and his team are taking care of things. They don't know how, and they don't want to know. The fact is the ordinary Joe doesn't think this government has made any major mistakes, and they don't see any pressing reason to change things.

There's no reason for us to pick up on any 'character' problems that Warren Kinsella thinks he can associate with the PM. (Why doesn't someone look at Warren Kinsella's character?)

Quote:
Electing JT leader tells me that Mulcair and the NDP are the target in 2015.
More specifically Quebec.

The Liberals aren't going to the mat on the "big issues" they just want 100 seats so that in 2019 if Harper has step down they have a shot to secure something respectable west of Quebec.

Most of the polls we see with Trudeau as leader of the LPC show massive swings of support in Quebec and Atlantic Canada, but not exactly lighting the world on fire west of there.

This is before he has opened his mouth on a significant issue, or been properly "vetted".

Trudeau is the easiest path to 90 - 100 seats, however beyond that you need to out Harper Harper and thats proving a little more complicated then most thought.


This is an astute observation.

If you are correct, the Liberals are playing to position themselves to win in two elections from now! Can it be that they are modelling themselves on Dalton McGuinty?

Think about it ... how could the Conservative Party have manoevred more brilliantly? However temporary, how could they have a greater political victory than this?
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 26 of 30

Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30  Next  


 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


2013 Liberal Leadership Race - April 14, 2013

phpBBCopyright 2001, 2005 phpBB