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mrsocko





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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
All religions are the same--exactly the same.


Your an idiot. Oh sorry, a spiritual idiot :roll:
Craig
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I am critical of Islam you make a subtle suggestion that I am a Nazi. But while it is apparently NOT okay for me to be critical of Islam it apparently IS okay for you to be critical of ALL religions. THAT is hypocrisy. And is a cheap liberal debate tactic.

The bottom line here is that 50 people were injured in riots because someone disrespected a BOOK call the Koran. I don't recall the last time Christians rioted because someone mistreated the Bible.

You can defend this behavior all you want and pretend that Christians and Muslims are equal. You won't convince me of that and I doubt anyone who reads this thread will be convinced either.

You are a Dhimmi.
Hasdrubal





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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually it's not that Muslims are destroying society, it's the government that ignores it's people, it's the government with their constant propaganda unfairly targeting Christians with unjustified hate laws, & last & not least it's the people for not fighting back.
905 Tory





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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Craig you said that people disrespected a BOOK. Yeah right. So you're telling me that if you were walking down the street and someone was ripping up the bible, you wouldn't be utterly offended. Well, these Greek Muslims were offended. That's inevitable. However, its in their culture, not religion, to act out in this way. Tamils mostly aren't Muslims, yet there were people who wanted the protests to get violent. Also, how many terrorists in 9/11 were European or North American born and raised? I am just trying to make a point where the attack of this religion starts to become exaggerated and eventually becomes unfounded. I remember someone saying something along the lines that Islam's growth (in numbers) can only be stopped by war a couple months back. See, something like that is said and then we complain that the Liberals are unfounded in their claims that we are bigots.
Craig
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

905 Tory wrote:
we complain that the Liberals are unfounded in their claims that we are bigots.


Bigotry is when one is partial to ones own group. I like Buddhism, Hinduism, Judaism, etc.. I just don't like Islam. It is a violent and repressive religion that is more prone to violence than other religions and oppresses women. If you can't see that then you are blind.
905 Tory





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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 3:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Craig wrote:

Bigotry is when one is partial to ones own group. I like Buddhism, Hinduism, Judaism, etc.. I just don't like Islam. It is a violent and repressive religion that is more prone to violence than other religions and oppresses women. If you can't see that then you are blind.


No, you are right. However, I ain't calling you a bigot. I am just saying that we complain when this party and its members are called rednecks and whatnot when this type of group-bashing and I might as well say it, borderlining on hate speech, becomes more common than when we promote fiscal responsibility and small government. Look, this is in relative importance, there are way too many threads devoted to bashing Islam and so very few actually talking about something that can be done to increase individual liberty and lower spending/taxes. You are a Canadian and can feel whatever way you want but its also important to understand that Tories/Reform don't just visit blogging tories, this is a public domain. I wouldn't be surprised to see M.P.'s of all parties take a peak. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised to see Muslim voters take a peak. Thus, I wouldn't be surprised to see Wajid Khan (a former liberal turned conservative) take a peak.
Ken Scheffler





Joined: 18 May 2009
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

905 Tory wrote:
Craig you said that people disrespected a BOOK. Yeah right. So you're telling me that if you were walking down the street and someone was ripping up the bible, you wouldn't be utterly offended. Well, these Greek Muslims were offended.

Honestly, nowadays, somebody ripping up a Bible is pretty tame. Without a doubt, the most malicious and hateful comments that I've come across on mainstream message boards is directed towards Christians and Christianity.
Ken Scheffler





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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

905 Tory wrote:

Christianity was used as an excuse for the slavery of Africans in North America.

Yeah, Christianity doesn't send suicide bombers but Christians have killed just as many people over the years in the name of Christianity. Read up on historically bloody times.

That's right, it's used as an "excuse" but if you've read the Bible, specifically the New Testament, you should know that all these things that were done "in the name of Christianity" don't jibe with Christ's teachings.

Slavery in North America was the result of secular economic theories, and the institution of slavery in the Confederacy states in particular was justified more through the classical world (Ancient Greece and Rome) than Christianity.
Craig
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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2009 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

905 Tory wrote:
No, you are right. However, I ain't calling you a bigot. I am just saying that we complain when this party and its members are called rednecks and whatnot when this type of group-bashing and I might as well say it, borderlining on hate speech, becomes more common than when we promote fiscal responsibility and small government. Look, this is in relative importance, there are way too many threads devoted to bashing Islam and so very few actually talking about something that can be done to increase individual liberty and lower spending/taxes. You are a Canadian and can feel whatever way you want but its also important to understand that Tories/Reform don't just visit blogging tories, this is a public domain. I wouldn't be surprised to see M.P.'s of all parties take a peak. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised to see Muslim voters take a peak. Thus, I wouldn't be surprised to see Wajid Khan (a former liberal turned conservative) take a peak.


Earlier in this thread you spoke about how Christianity was used as an excuse for slavery. In the end it was the Christians (predominantly the Quakers, Baptists, and Methodists) who ended slavery. Until I see large swaths of "moderate" Muslims marginalizing the "extremists" then I will continue to berate Islam - and I don't give a shit what the politically correct chattering class in Ontario thinks about that. But instead of seeing them attempt to marginalize the extremists I see them parading by the tens of thousands in large cities around the world cheering for the death of "infidels". I see riots in Paris and Athens about trivial things like disrespecting a book. And to your earlier comment about how Christians react to these types of things. Jesus is mocked constantly in our media - barely an episode of "Family Guy" has aired where Jesus wasn't mocked. But has any radical Christian tried to kill Seth McFarland? No - because we are a modern and progressive religion that has learned to tolerate criticism. Islam is NOT - they kill people over cartoons and jail female teachers who call a teddy bear "Mohamed".
mrsocko





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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Craig you said that people disrespected a BOOK. Yeah right. So you're telling me that if you were walking down the street and someone was ripping up the bible, you wouldn't be utterly offended


I'm a evangelical/pentecostal and I wouldn't give a sh*t if someone ripped a bible up in front of me. It's a book. Who cares!

If you really believe in God you must acknowlege that God is in control. I don't understand everything but I trust he will deal with all people in his just way.

If you are a religious nut you feel you must defend God or your religion by attacking those who attack you.

Jesus said turn the other cheek. Other religions say kill the infidel. You tell me which is more just.
Craig
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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrsocko wrote:
Quote:
Craig you said that people disrespected a BOOK. Yeah right. So you're telling me that if you were walking down the street and someone was ripping up the bible, you wouldn't be utterly offended


I'm a evangelical/pentecostal and I wouldn't give a sh*t if someone ripped a bible up in front of me. It's a book. Who cares!

If you really believe in God you must acknowlege that God is in control. I don't understand everything but I trust he will deal with all people in his just way.

If you are a religious nut you feel you must defend God or your religion by attacking those who attack you.

Jesus said turn the other cheek. Other religions say kill the infidel. You tell me which is more just.


Good point. I probably would be offended. But I wouldn't riot. And I wouldn't cut off the guy's head or stab him 50 times in the chest...

905 Tory





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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrsocko wrote:
Jesus said turn the other cheek. Other religions say kill the infidel. You tell me which is more just.


Which religions, other than Islam are you talking about?
SmartCon





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PostPosted: Tue May 26, 2009 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, quite the blogg.

Just a side note, there are extremists in ALL religions, not just Islam. Further, the Koran like the Bible has many interpretations. Have a read of the Koran, it's interesting. You can find English versions online. The passages I read that have violent content, leave the rights to commit violence to God or "Alah". This is no different than then Bible as God does do a bit of smiting and can be a bit of a tough guy now cant he. Interpreting the Koran as a way to justify violence in the attacks discussed here, is no different than the Klu Klux Klan interpreting the Bible to justify their violent behavior.

But look at the similarities between Muslim extremists and a Christian extremist like The Klan. They are undereducated and usually poor. They have had a identifiable race or group of people from a identifiable race possibly do something to them. They use there own interpretation of a Holy book to justify their causes.

In principle, they are very similar. However, what the world of Islam and the Christian world do not have in common is their progression. More Christians live in the economically stable world of North America, Europe and several countries outside those continents. These countries are far more advanced, have far better educational opportunities and far more opportunities in general than the Muslin world.

If a Muslin person living in Afghanistan, Iraq, Northern Pakistan and other parts of the middle east could grow up with a good education, good job prospects and without extremist indoctrinating teaching of the Muslin faith they would not be extremists. The same could be said about the Christian person growing up poor in the a small rural community where the Bible is interpreted to hate gays, Muslims and and other minorities.

Religious extremism exists in all faiths. But what I am sure we can all agree on is that the teaching of extremism dwells away from the true intention of faith.
Craig
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PostPosted: Tue May 26, 2009 12:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SmartCon wrote:
Further, the Koran like the Bible has many interpretations.


Not exactly. The Koran claims to be the direct word of God not open to interpretation. The Bible is the word of God expressed through others and is open to interpretation.

Quote:
Have a read of the Koran, it's interesting. You can find English versions online.


I found the parts that called for the death of non-believers interesting and the part that called for special taxes on non-Islamic believers.

Quote:
This is no different than then Bible as God does do a bit of smiting and can be a bit of a tough guy now cant he.


We aren't debating the books here. We are debating the followers. There have been 13255 documented Islamic terrorist acts since 9/11. Christianity has evolved into a tolerant and progressive religion. Islam has not.

Here is the listing of attacks...

http://www.thereligionofpeace......ml#Attacks
TorontoCon





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PostPosted: Tue May 26, 2009 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd like to pose a question that I think is relevant to this thread. How long will it be until we see the same thing happen in CANADA?

I'd like to bring the question closer to home.

Could the same thing happen in Canada? If so, what do we do about it?

Those two questions are most important to me when I hear of these things happening in other countries.

IMO multiculturalism is a recipe for disaster. It's naive to think otherwise.

I'm sure we would all like to say "can't we all get along?" (myself included), but the reality is that it is not human nature to be fully accepting of people that are different than you (not speaking from an individual's standpoint, but from a larger populace). I WISH it wasnt' that way, but it clearly IS. Some people are more accepting than others. Some are not. And it is the 25% of people that resist acceptance (I have no idea on stats and percentages...but you get the picture) where the conflicts start.

To answer my own question above. I think that the answer to question #1. is YES the same thing COULD happen here in Canada.

As for #2? I think that we are past any point of control over the situation until major events start to happen in our Country.

Trudeau opened Pandora's box.
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