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Craig
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:30 pm    Post subject: How do you stop socialisms incremental gains? Reply with quote

It seems that no matter who wins power that slowly over time our taxes go up and government becomes more intrusive into our lives. How do you stop it before it is too late and we are all governed by a massive and unstoppable global socialist government?
Rusty Bedsprings





Joined: 06 Dec 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Everybody replys: stop it? why would you want to stop it? (everybody moves in closer to Craig, very evilly... and charges him with hate)
Mac





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Location: John Baird's riding...

PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought we were already ruled by a global socialist government. Isn't that what the UN is all about?

The first step to reversing the tide of socialism is learning to get along amongst ourselves. As long as we continue to fight over every little thing, we continue to ignore those many things we agree on... and we leave ourselves open to the attacks of the left. Until we conquer that hurdle, we're just marking time.

-Mac
Craig
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mac wrote:
I thought we were already ruled by a global socialist government. Isn't that what the UN is all about?

The first step to reversing the tide of socialism is learning to get along amongst ourselves. As long as we continue to fight over every little thing, we continue to ignore those many things we agree on... and we leave ourselves open to the attacks of the left. Until we conquer that hurdle, we're just marking time.

-Mac


I disagree. We need another cold war to remind people that global governance will never work. We are different and we compete. Humans can't escape the basic tenets of nature that every other species abides by.
Mac





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PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Craig wrote:
I disagree. We need another cold war to remind people that global governance will never work. We are different and we compete. Humans can't escape the basic tenets of nature that every other species abides by.

You've got a point. The biggest problems with socialism is the requirement to push aside human nature, to ignore differences, to actively seek to quash competition...

I'll have to give your original question more thought.

-Mac
kwlafayette





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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, first you have to stop agreeing with them. One of the incremental gains, and as I remember it was widely applauded around here, was the ban on incandescent light bulbs. Oh, it was no big deal, it was good policy, not unwarranted intrusion into people lives and homes. Kind of makes it that much harder to disagree with the next one though.
melwilde





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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The very best question to date! about 45 years ago the left people were asking themselves the same question. Saul Alinsky and then Tommy Douglas told them to get their feet on the street and start organizing.
They went on to say that folks needed to set priorities on who to organize first, ie teachers, people at journalism schools and all media institutions. Sau in particular promoted confrontation although he kept stressing non violence.
I was startled by their view that people should stop crying about the media and judges etc and get off their behinds and do some tihing real rather than cry about it. The clearest thing I remember is that they preached changing society by changing the products of our schools and Universities.
You may ask yourself, how does some old guy named mel remember this stuff. Well, old mel wasn't always old and in my younger days I was fooled by the panacea of the left.
I even hired Saul a few times to teach organizing skills.
For those interested in learning from the enemy you might want to buy the small book "rules for radicals", by Saul D Alinsky. I still have my signed copy. A contemporary example of what saul preached "do Some thing" would be to watch Ezra Levant and his
He is doing something.
I trust everyone will have a great day. I know I will...I'm out organizing a meeting for my PC member of the house!
If we all work as hard as Ezra then we just might turn this country around..working at it would be a lot more useful then trying to tell our Prime minister what he should be or should not be doing.
DixieCanuck





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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 1:37 pm    Post subject: Re: How do you stop socialisms incremental gains? Reply with quote

Craig wrote:
It seems that no matter who wins power that slowly over time our taxes go up and government becomes more intrusive into our lives. How do you stop it before it is too late and we are all governed by a massive and unstoppable global socialist government?


Vote Libertarian. Or Christian Heritage Party if you are more socially conservative inclined. If your principles stay the same while the party moves away, why would you stay with a party that no longer represents your interests? At least they have principles that don't fluctuate according to how close/far power is. Each vote would show the Conservative Party where we all stand and it's not with the a-little-less-socialism-than-the-other-guy party.
Forward





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PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 4:05 pm    Post subject: Re: How do you stop socialisms incremental gains? Reply with quote

DixieCanuck wrote:
Craig wrote:
It seems that no matter who wins power that slowly over time our taxes go up and government becomes more intrusive into our lives. How do you stop it before it is too late and we are all governed by a massive and unstoppable global socialist government?


Vote Libertarian. Or Christian Heritage Party if you are more socially conservative inclined. If your principles stay the same while the party moves away, why would you stay with a party that no longer represents your interests? At least they have principles that don't fluctuate according to how close/far power is. Each vote would show the Conservative Party where we all stand and it's not with the a-little-less-socialism-than-the-other-guy party.


BRAVO!! :D

Aother tactic is to refuse to obey laws you consider unjust, keeping in mind you may pay the price for doing so. Firearms registration is my example.
FF_Canuck





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PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2009 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is OT, but I'd echo mel wilde's suggestion at looking into Alinky's Rules for Radicals - in addition to knowing how socialists work in general, it'll give you some major insight into the hows and whys of Obama's organization (now and before).
kwlafayette





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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Back to my earlier point, how many people here agree with the socialists, that the financial meltdown is all the fault of evil capitalists, and that they must be fettered, and re-fettered post haste?

PS. Mel is right, you have to push back, and your push back should be completely disproportionate.
Craig
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 11:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kwlafayette wrote:
Back to my earlier point, how many people here agree with the socialists, that the financial meltdown is all the fault of evil capitalists, and that they must be fettered, and re-fettered post haste?


I view the financial meltdown as a natural correction. Yes, it is the fault of greedy capitalists. Does that make capitalism bad? No. Does that mean we need more regulation? No. It just means that we have to accept that once every 50 years we are going to experience some negative growth and stop crying about it and accept the pain for a couple of years while things get back to normal.
kwlafayette





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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes that is right, it is the fault of greedy capitalists; it has nothing to do with the government interfering in the market. There is no possible way that the boom and bust cycle could actually be created by government interference. Why, that would be crazy capitalist talk. Everybody knows the socialists are right on this one.
mrsocko





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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
It seems that no matter who wins power that slowly over time our taxes go up and government becomes more intrusive into our lives. How do you stop it before it is too late and we are all governed by a massive and unstoppable global socialist government?


I don't think it is socialism at all. What we have in government are people who think they can control and solve every problem or crisis that comes along. Is a deficit of 1.75 trillion dollars this year in the States really neccesary or are the braniacs who run the goverment over thinking the situation.

Even if there is no crisis egotistical polititians think they have to do some grandious thing that will cement their position in history.

Ideology had little to do with Martin attempting the Kelowna accords or national freakin Day Care. He just wanted to have a major program with his name on it. Egotist.

Harper I don't get. He doesn't come across as an out of control ego driven polititian, but he has not lessened government control of our lives at all. He has spent money on a plan to convince Canadians that the CPC is not to be feared. We won't slash government spending. We won't get rid of the programs you love.

KW is right. He should have let the coalition own this recession. Then we would have had our majority and carte balnche to cut programs, reign in the HRCs and end equalization(my own pet peeve).
DixieCanuck





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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrsocko wrote:
Harper I don't get. He doesn't come across as an out of control ego driven polititian, but he has not lessened government control of our lives at all. He has spent money on a plan to convince Canadians that the CPC is not to be feared. We won't slash government spending. We won't get rid of the programs you love.


So he's lying or not actually going to do what we hope he will. Either way, that's not a path I'm willing to walk myself. Do many party supporters think that our principles are so distasteful that we need to resort to that or even worse, are willing to forgo those principles merely to have the team colours in power? My opinion is that conservative principles and policies ARE popular but have been distorted by the left from what we actually stand for.

mrsocko wrote:
KW is right. He should have let the coalition own this recession. Then we would have had our majority and carte balnche to cut programs, reign in the HRCs and end equalization(my own pet peeve).


What if the CPC actually does chase down that majority dragon then doesn't enact enact the policies we all expect them to because they need to fight the next election to keep power. Is that another dragon on the horizon or is it actually the same dragon? If the CPC is just a slightly less socialist party, isn't there something about a tyrant and a citadel we should keep in mind? Perhaps laying the foundations for other options is a prudent course so not to be caught footed or just to be merely the whisper of conscience to a drifting party.
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How do you stop socialisms incremental gains?

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