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| Should we expand Canadian access to Concealed Weapon Permits? |
| No, we should ban handguns. |
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12% |
[ 4 ] |
| No, we should keep our gun laws where they are. |
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15% |
[ 5 ] |
| Yes, Restricted - ie. to off duty, retired, and part-time law enforcement officers. |
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9% |
[ 3 ] |
| Yes, May Issue |
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25% |
[ 8 ] |
| Yes, Shall Issue |
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37% |
[ 12 ] |
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| Total Votes : 32 |
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ezbeatz
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Posts: 1140
  
votes: 10
Location: Vaughan, ON
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 Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 7:35 pm Post subject: |
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| crazymamma wrote: | | Cole wrote: | | I'll show you one that says the opposite, |
Do it, find it, produce it. |
Hey Crazy Mamma, I posted a link to an article on the Times of London website that argued in favour of concealed carry. It pays particular attention to the Mumbai massacre and how the armed police refused to engage the terrorists resulting in many innocent casualties.
When seconds mean the difference between life and death, help is only minutes away. |
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ezbeatz
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Posts: 1140
votes: 10
Location: Vaughan, ON
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 7:43 pm Post subject: |
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ezbeatz
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Posts: 1140
votes: 10
Location: Vaughan, ON
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Does anybody know how many guns are in Canada. Officially, I hear it's 7.2 or 7.4 million. But I think it's higher. |
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Craig
Site Admin
Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 4415
votes: 36
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Oh here we go round and round. You produce your stats from gun loving sites and I'll produce mine from gun hating sites. This "debate" (and I use that term loosely) has really degenerated. |
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Craig
Site Admin
Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 4415
votes: 36
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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| fkarcha wrote: | | so-called conservatives |
:roll: |
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Craig
Site Admin
Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 4415
votes: 36
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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| kwlafayette wrote: | | optimus2861 wrote: | | Cole wrote: | | I can't trust John Q Public not to break down one day after a really really bad day at work and blow me away because I took his parking spot. |
Here's the problem with this statement: logically, you can't restrict it to firearms.
"I can't trust John Q Public not to break my neck ... we can't allow the public to have martial arts training."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to stab me ... we can't allow the public to have knives."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to burn me ... we can't allow the public to have lighters."
You can either choose to live in fear of law-abiding citizens, or not. If you choose not to, that's your problem, not mine. You don't have the right to restrict my rights because you're afraid. |
Doesn't this lead to the "words have power" argument, and human rights commissions? |
Conversely - if I can trust you with a handgun why not a rocket launcher or a nuclear weapon??? What - you don't trust your neighbour to have a nuclear weapon in his basement. What kind of paranoid delusional are you?!? |
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ezbeatz
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Posts: 1140
votes: 10
Location: Vaughan, ON
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Craig wrote: | | Oh here we go round and round. You produce your stats from gun loving sites and I'll produce mine from gun hating sites. This "debate" (and I use that term loosely) has really degenerated. |
Are you talking to me? I haven't put any stats up yet. I just put a map of States in the US and their various laws regarding carry permits. |
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Craig wrote: | | kwlafayette wrote: | | optimus2861 wrote: | | Cole wrote: | | I can't trust John Q Public not to break down one day after a really really bad day at work and blow me away because I took his parking spot. |
Here's the problem with this statement: logically, you can't restrict it to firearms.
"I can't trust John Q Public not to break my neck ... we can't allow the public to have martial arts training."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to stab me ... we can't allow the public to have knives."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to burn me ... we can't allow the public to have lighters."
You can either choose to live in fear of law-abiding citizens, or not. If you choose not to, that's your problem, not mine. You don't have the right to restrict my rights because you're afraid. |
Doesn't this lead to the "words have power" argument, and human rights commissions? |
Conversely - if I can trust you with a handgun why not a rocket launcher or a nuclear weapon??? What - you don't trust your neighbour to have a nuclear weapon in his basement. What kind of paranoid delusional are you?!? |
Usually Craig you are one of the more intelligent debaters on this board, but your emotional response and inability to use anything but "your fear and distrust" to fuel your sarcasm and ridicule has forced me to be resigned that your objections are neither rational nor intellectual in nature.
I will not make the mistake of thinking you are open to anything but your own views regurgitated for your pleasure on this particular topic again. |
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Cole
Joined: 19 Oct 2008
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| crazymamma wrote: | | Craig wrote: | | kwlafayette wrote: | | optimus2861 wrote: | | Cole wrote: | | I can't trust John Q Public not to break down one day after a really really bad day at work and blow me away because I took his parking spot. |
Here's the problem with this statement: logically, you can't restrict it to firearms.
"I can't trust John Q Public not to break my neck ... we can't allow the public to have martial arts training."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to stab me ... we can't allow the public to have knives."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to burn me ... we can't allow the public to have lighters."
You can either choose to live in fear of law-abiding citizens, or not. If you choose not to, that's your problem, not mine. You don't have the right to restrict my rights because you're afraid. |
Doesn't this lead to the "words have power" argument, and human rights commissions? |
Conversely - if I can trust you with a handgun why not a rocket launcher or a nuclear weapon??? What - you don't trust your neighbour to have a nuclear weapon in his basement. What kind of paranoid delusional are you?!? |
Usually Craig you are one of the more intelligent debaters on this board, but your emotional response and inability to use anything but "your fear and distrust" to fuel your sarcasm and ridicule has forced me to be resigned that your objections are neither rational nor intellectual in nature.
I will not make the mistake of thinking you are open to anything but your own views regurgitated for your pleasure on this particular topic again. |
Although he does make a valid point, if I am supposed to trust you with a handgun, why can't you trust me with a tank, SADM, or a biological weapon?
Point is where do you draw the line? I wasn't being rhetorical, anyone have any suggestions on what a limit would be on the type of gun a person should carry? |
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Cole wrote: | | crazymamma wrote: | | Craig wrote: | | kwlafayette wrote: | | optimus2861 wrote: | | Cole wrote: | | I can't trust John Q Public not to break down one day after a really really bad day at work and blow me away because I took his parking spot. |
Here's the problem with this statement: logically, you can't restrict it to firearms.
"I can't trust John Q Public not to break my neck ... we can't allow the public to have martial arts training."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to stab me ... we can't allow the public to have knives."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to burn me ... we can't allow the public to have lighters."
You can either choose to live in fear of law-abiding citizens, or not. If you choose not to, that's your problem, not mine. You don't have the right to restrict my rights because you're afraid. |
Doesn't this lead to the "words have power" argument, and human rights commissions? |
Conversely - if I can trust you with a handgun why not a rocket launcher or a nuclear weapon??? What - you don't trust your neighbour to have a nuclear weapon in his basement. What kind of paranoid delusional are you?!? |
Usually Craig you are one of the more intelligent debaters on this board, but your emotional response and inability to use anything but "your fear and distrust" to fuel your sarcasm and ridicule has forced me to be resigned that your objections are neither rational nor intellectual in nature.
I will not make the mistake of thinking you are open to anything but your own views regurgitated for your pleasure on this particular topic again. |
Although he does make a valid point, if I am supposed to trust you with a handgun, why can't you trust me with a tank, SADM, or a biological weapon?
Point is where do you draw the line? I wasn't being rhetorical, anyone have any suggestions on what a limit would be? |
Well, even I don't have a purse big enough to put a rocket launcher in, tanks while they handle well in the Canadian winters are a bit*h to find good parking next to the doors at the mall, SADM's require jumping out of a plane and that plays havoc with my hair, biological weapons are just plain messy....ewwww. |
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Mac
Joined: 02 Sep 2006
Posts: 5500
votes: 35
Location: John Baird's riding...
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 9:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Cole wrote: | Although he does make a valid point, if I am supposed to trust you with a handgun, why can't you trust me with a tank, SADM, or a biological weapon?
Point is where do you draw the line? I wasn't being rhetorical, anyone have any suggestions on what a limit would be on the type of gun a person should carry? |
Here's a little factoid you might not have known... It is not illegal to own a tank, a full-sized howitzer, an anti-aircraft gun or a bazooka... and they don't have to be registered either. I know a guy who operates his own "museum" including numerous military ordinance delivery systems, tanks, you name it. A bit too big to pack into a purse, I know, but imagine the impression you'd make towing a howitzer behind your Hummer...
Now where would you like to draw that line again? :D
-Mac |
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ezbeatz
Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Posts: 1140
votes: 10
Location: Vaughan, ON
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Craig wrote: | | kwlafayette wrote: | | optimus2861 wrote: | | Cole wrote: | | I can't trust John Q Public not to break down one day after a really really bad day at work and blow me away because I took his parking spot. |
Here's the problem with this statement: logically, you can't restrict it to firearms.
"I can't trust John Q Public not to break my neck ... we can't allow the public to have martial arts training."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to stab me ... we can't allow the public to have knives."
"I can't trust John Q Public not to burn me ... we can't allow the public to have lighters."
You can either choose to live in fear of law-abiding citizens, or not. If you choose not to, that's your problem, not mine. You don't have the right to restrict my rights because you're afraid. |
Doesn't this lead to the "words have power" argument, and human rights commissions? |
Conversely - if I can trust you with a handgun why not a rocket launcher or a nuclear weapon??? What - you don't trust your neighbour to have a nuclear weapon in his basement. What kind of paranoid delusional are you?!? |
What does concealed carry have to do with nuclear weapons? And if I'm not mistaken, the presence of US nuclear warheads was a major deterrent against the Soviet Union. |
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Craig
Site Admin
Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 4415
votes: 36
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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| ezbeatz wrote: | | What does concealed carry have to do with nuclear weapons? And if I'm not mistaken, the presence of US nuclear warheads was a major deterrent against the Soviet Union. |
If you folks are going to make ridiculous suggestions that being opposed to handguns is the same thing as human rights tribunals then I'll make equally ridiculous suggestions that if you trust your fellow man as much as you contend that you do then I suppose you wouldn't mind if your neighbor had a live nuke in his basement (you know - for protection). It's all about trust right? Why stop at handguns? Can I carry a rocket launcher around town. No? Why not? You don't trust me? What about a few hand grenades? Are you okay with that? |
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Craig
Site Admin
Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 4415
votes: 36
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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| crazymamma wrote: | your sarcasm and ridicule has forced me to be resigned that your objections are neither rational nor intellectual in nature.
I will not make the mistake of thinking you are open to anything but your own views regurgitated for your pleasure on this particular topic again. |
You are the one acting high and mighty in this thread. And I'm not the only one who has pointed it out. So spare me your trash talk. |
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Craig
Site Admin
Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 4415
votes: 36
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| Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| crazymamma wrote: | | I will not make the mistake of thinking you are open to anything but your own views regurgitated for your pleasure on this particular topic again. |
It should be noted that at least I attempted to compromise very early in this thread...
| Quote: | | I could support a very stringent form of this where people who have had significant training (a basic law enforcement course) would be allowed to carry. I just oppose blanket legalization. |
So WHO is the one not open to anything but their own views??? Who??? Perhaps you can show me where YOU compromised on this subject? I'll wait patiently....
Last edited by Craig on Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:28 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Thoughts on Concealed Carry in Canada |
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