Home FAQ Search Memberlist User Groups Register Login   

BloggingTories.ca Forum IndexBloggingTories.ca Forum Index
    Index     FAQ     Search     Register     Login         JOIN THE DISCUSSION - CLICK HERE      

*NEW* Login or register using your Facebook account.

Not a member? Join the fastest growing conservative community!
Membership is free and takes 15 seconds


CLICK HERE or use Facebook to login or register ----> Connect



Goto page 1, 2  Next  

Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 1 of 2
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Craig
Site Admin




Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 4415
Reputation: 47.8Reputation: 47.8Reputation: 47.8Reputation: 47.8Reputation: 47.8
votes: 36

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 12:24 am    Post subject: My genes made me do it Reply with quote

I guess smoking isn't a choice...

Quote:
Researchers Find Genetic Connection to Cigarette Smoking

Certain Gene Found to Influence Why People Start Smoking and Why Some Get Addicted and Others Don't


I guess committing a crime isn't a choice...

Quote:
Criminals Share A Common Genetic Flaw


http://www.popularmechanics.co.....82176.html

So smoking and committing crimes is like skin color right - you are born with it - right??? That's what I hear anyway - my genes made me do it.
Mac





Joined: 02 Sep 2006
Posts: 5500
Reputation: 104
votes: 35
Location: John Baird's riding...

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 12:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The argument which will never be resolved: genes versus environment versus choice...

Interesting article which begs the question: can a genetic solution be found for additions and/or crime? If so, who gets to decide what constitutes a crime or an addiction?

-Mac
FascistLibertarian





Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1092
Reputation: 30.1Reputation: 30.1Reputation: 30.1
votes: 14
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stop being so harsh on people with substance abuse disorder....
But seriousely there is a genetic mutation that certain men have which makes them violent.
XXY or someshit.
truth4freedom





Joined: 14 Jan 2007
Posts: 255
Reputation: 23.7Reputation: 23.7
votes: 3
Location: Bible Belt USA!

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mac wrote:
Interesting article which begs the question: can a genetic solution be found for additions and/or crime? If so, who gets to decide what constitutes a crime or an addiction?

-Mac


We tried to resolve this with eugenics in the early 20th century in the USA. Now we have Planned Parenthood taking up the banner of genetic catagorization and elimination. With politicians like Obamessiah in the mix our elitist society may be leaning toward attemting to decide what is acceptable to them once again by using vile methods that kill our freedom and bodies. Soilent green anyone?
FascistLibertarian





Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1092
Reputation: 30.1Reputation: 30.1Reputation: 30.1
votes: 14
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

eugenics in the past was based on flawed concepts and beliefs. In the future it will be based on designer babies for rich people.
gc





Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 1698
Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4
votes: 16
Location: A Monochromatic World

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's interesting to think that it is a combination of genetics and environment that determines everything we do - and we have no control over either of them :shock:

Not that people should use that as an excuse.
Bleatmop





Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 953
Reputation: 17.5Reputation: 17.5
votes: 10

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gc wrote:
It's interesting to think that it is a combination of genetics and environment that determines everything we do - and we have no control over either of them :shock:

Not that people should use that as an excuse.


I agree that it is very interesting, though I would say that we do have a degree of control over our environment. Not when we are children mind you, but as adults. But then you could get into the early vs later experience debate and the resiliency debate. Needless to say I enjoyed my psychology classes in uni :) As much as we know about the human mind, we still have a vast ocean of knowledge left to explore.
gc





Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 1698
Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4
votes: 16
Location: A Monochromatic World

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bleatmop wrote:
I agree that it is very interesting, though I would say that we do have a degree of control over our environment. Not when we are children mind you, but as adults. But then you could get into the early vs later experience debate and the resiliency debate. Needless to say I enjoyed my psychology classes in uni :) As much as we know about the human mind, we still have a vast ocean of knowledge left to explore.

Maybe this is getting a bit deep, but do we really have control over our environment? How do we control it, by making choices? But how are those choices to influence our environment made - they are made by our genes and our environment. I guess sort of like a catch 22, we can't make our own choices unless we can change our environment/genes, but we can't change our environment/genes unless we can make our own choices.
I suppose this is somewhat related to determinism
And while many scientists don't believe in determinism, many (most notably Einstein) do. Hence his famous line "God does not play dice". I tend to agree with Einstein. And even if it's not true, that doesn't mean that we humans have any control over what happens to us.
Cool Blue





Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 3130
Reputation: 114.9
votes: 10
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Take your soma and try not to think about it.
Bleatmop





Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 953
Reputation: 17.5Reputation: 17.5
votes: 10

PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gc wrote:
Maybe this is getting a bit deep, but do we really have control over our environment? How do we control it, by making choices? But how are those choices to influence our environment made - they are made by our genes and our environment. I guess sort of like a catch 22, we can't make our own choices unless we can change our environment/genes, but we can't change our environment/genes unless we can make our own choices.
I suppose this is somewhat related to determinism
And while many scientists don't believe in determinism, many (most notably Einstein) do. Hence his famous line "God does not play dice". I tend to agree with Einstein. And even if it's not true, that doesn't mean that we humans have any control over what happens to us.


Lol, well, you bring up some interesting points, but I have always been a big believer in psychological resilience. Whereas a environmental determinist may believe there is a viscous cycle between environment and behavior, I believe that that is only true for those who are not resilient. This excerpt from the wiki page describes it better than I:

Quote:
Emmy Werner was one of the first scientists to use the term resilience in 1970s. She studied a cohort of children from Kauai (Hawaiian Islands). Kauai was quite poor and many of the children in the study grew up with alcoholic or mentally ill parents. Many of the parents were also out of work [3]. Werner noted that of the children who grew up in these very bad situations, two-thirds exhibited destructive behaviors in their later teen years, such as chronic unemployment, substance abuse, and out-of-wedlock births (in case of teenage-girls). However one-third of these youngsters did not exhibit destructive behaviors. Werner called the latter group resilient [4]. Resilient children and their families had traits that made them different from non-resilient children and families. Resilience emerged as a major theoretical and research topic from the studies of children of schizophrenic mothers in the 1980s (Luthar, Cicchetti, & Becker, 2000; Masten, Best, & Garmezy, 1990)
gc





Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 1698
Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4
votes: 16
Location: A Monochromatic World

PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bleatmop wrote:
Lol, well, you bring up some interesting points, but I have always been a big believer in psychological resilience.

Interesting article, but do you think perhaps psychological resilience could be caused by genes (another factor that we have no control over)? Or perhaps more subtle environmental factors?
Bleatmop





Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 953
Reputation: 17.5Reputation: 17.5
votes: 10

PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gc wrote:
Bleatmop wrote:
Lol, well, you bring up some interesting points, but I have always been a big believer in psychological resilience.

Interesting article, but do you think perhaps psychological resilience could be caused by genes (another factor that we have no control over)? Or perhaps more subtle environmental factors?


I suppose it's possible. I don't know the answer to that question. Perhaps I could get a government grant to study that question :wink:

In all seriousness, I do believe in environmental factors, though I believe resilience is stronger than the environmental factors. Where people get their resilience from, I don't know. There seems to be plenty of examples of people overcoming all obstacles and vice versa. Perhaps I just prefer the resilience argument because my environment has conditioned me to believe in it :lol:
gc





Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 1698
Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4
votes: 16
Location: A Monochromatic World

PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bleatmop wrote:
Perhaps I could get a government grant to study that question :wink:

:lol:
Quote:
In all seriousness, I do believe in environmental factors, though I believe resilience is stronger than the environmental factors. Where people get their resilience from, I don't know. There seems to be plenty of examples of people overcoming all obstacles and vice versa. Perhaps I just prefer the resilience argument because my environment has conditioned me to believe in it :lol:

Well, I guess we can agree that neither of us know the answer. Interesting topic though, nice chatting with you :)
FascistLibertarian





Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1092
Reputation: 30.1Reputation: 30.1Reputation: 30.1
votes: 14
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
though I believe resilience is stronger than the environmental factors.


Not really, half of the Canadians who landed on D-Day had PTSD for the rest of their life while 100% of Canadian POW's with the Japanese did.
People might have different levels of resilience, some people crack over nothing, but everyone has a breaking point where they will give up.
Bleatmop





Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 953
Reputation: 17.5Reputation: 17.5
votes: 10

PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gc wrote:
Bleatmop wrote:
Perhaps I could get a government grant to study that question :wink:

:lol:
Quote:
In all seriousness, I do believe in environmental factors, though I believe resilience is stronger than the environmental factors. Where people get their resilience from, I don't know. There seems to be plenty of examples of people overcoming all obstacles and vice versa. Perhaps I just prefer the resilience argument because my environment has conditioned me to believe in it :lol:

Well, I guess we can agree that neither of us know the answer. Interesting topic though, nice chatting with you :)


You too.
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 1 of 2

Goto page 1, 2  Next  


 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You can attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


My genes made me do it

phpBBCopyright 2001, 2005 phpBB