Home FAQ Search Memberlist User Groups Register Login   

BloggingTories.ca Forum IndexBloggingTories.ca Forum Index
    Index     FAQ     Search     Register     Login         JOIN THE DISCUSSION - CLICK HERE      

*NEW* Login or register using your Facebook account.

Not a member? Join the fastest growing conservative community!
Membership is free and takes 15 seconds


CLICK HERE or use Facebook to login or register ----> Connect



Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next  

Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 2 of 3
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
don muntean





Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 2262
Reputation: 34.9Reputation: 34.9Reputation: 34.9
votes: 8
Location: Saskatchewan

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 12:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Riley W wrote:
Ugh...I am not getting into this debate with you socons.

While your at it, how `bout condemning those who eat shrimp and those good 'ol Tory farmers who plant 2 different seeds side-by-side...

'cause you know Leviticus casts that as a "abomination" too.

:roll:

Must be so fun being a fundamentalists, being so caught up on the fringes of the Old Testament and completely forgetting about Christ's message of love, forgiveness, tolerance, acceptance, etc.


Don't cast me in this light too...please don't see Leviticus as some backward ancient code - the same God that authored that code - created life. There must be some reason for the rules and not only some esoteric connection! OF course some rules [like those that deal with temple sacrifice] don't apply now but many do! In fact many are just common sense rules.

I have [in the past] explained that other text in Leviticus [18.22] in another thread.

The abomination referenced in the text - is sodomy - not homosexuality.

Note that the text does not refer to two women [lesbians] - it is saying that if a man lie with a man - i.e.: intercourse:

"Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination."

Of course this chapter is not silent on women - it does make a reference to other customs 'women' must never do - please read the complete chapter.

So some people may try to make more of that text than is seen in this chapter and without a doubt there is no basis for maligning homosexuality based in this text.

Sodomy is a practice that is not healthy and is not pleasing to God. Sodomy is like slapping Him in the face. It is a custom of some people - as noted in text 30:

"Therefore shall ye keep mine ordinance, that ye commit not any one of these abominable customs, which were committed before you, and that ye defile not yourselves therein: I am the LORD your God."
Riley W





Joined: 08 Jul 2007
Posts: 857
Reputation: 35.5Reputation: 35.5Reputation: 35.5Reputation: 35.5
votes: 10
Location: Manitoba

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Then I hope you are consistent, and speak out against all the other abominations listed in Leviticus which include eating shrimp, and planting 2 different types of plants side by side.
Cool Blue





Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 3130
Reputation: 114.9
votes: 10
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Must be so fun being a fundamentalists, being so caught up on the fringes of the Old Testament and completely forgetting about Christ's message of love, forgiveness, tolerance, acceptance, etc.


I think you missed my point...
don muntean





Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 2262
Reputation: 34.9Reputation: 34.9Reputation: 34.9
votes: 8
Location: Saskatchewan

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 7:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Riley W wrote:
Then I hope you are consistent, and speak out against all the other abominations listed in Leviticus which include eating shrimp, and planting 2 different types of plants side by side.


Could there be any logical reason God ever commanded thus?
gc





Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 1698
Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4
votes: 16
Location: A Monochromatic World

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

urbanmonk wrote:
That was old testament not what Jesus taught, although I think Moses may have been onto something :~)

So is the Old Testament the word of God or isn't it? How do you choose which parts of it to ignore and which parts of it to listen to? As Don mentioned, it's not like God is going to change his mind, right?

Anyways, here's what Jesus has to say about the laws in the Old Testament:

"17"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."
(Matthew 5:17-18)

So doesn't that mean that Jesus supports the stoning of homosexuals?
gc





Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 1698
Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4
votes: 16
Location: A Monochromatic World

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Riley W wrote:
Then I hope you are consistent, and speak out against all the other abominations listed in Leviticus which include eating shrimp, and planting 2 different types of plants side by side.

...or stoning your own son if he is "stubborn" (Deuteronomy 21:18-21), killing any non-Christians (Deuteronomy 13), etc...
SFrank85





Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2269
Reputation: 59.8
votes: 4
Location: Toronto - Scarborough Southwest

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gc wrote:
urbanmonk wrote:
That was old testament not what Jesus taught, although I think Moses may have been onto something :~)


So doesn't that mean that Jesus supports the stoning of homosexuals?


John 8:1 - 11 scribes and Pharisees had caught a woman in the act of adultery (the woman commonly referred to as the prostitute) and told Jesus who was teaching in the temple that the Mosaic Law required she be stoned to death. Trying to make an opportunity of this to trick Jesus that they might accuse Him, they, with stones in hand, asked Jesus what He says about the Law. After Jesus tried to ignore their repeated questioning, He told them "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her." One by one each man dropped his stone and walked away.
potan





Joined: 30 Jul 2007
Posts: 582
Reputation: 36.3Reputation: 36.3Reputation: 36.3Reputation: 36.3
votes: 2
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 10:45 am    Post subject: wrong Reply with quote

Quote:
...or stoning your own son if he is "stubborn" (Deuteronomy 21:18-21), killing any non-Christians (Deuteronomy 13), etc...


um...Deuteronomy is in the old testament, and Jesus hadn't come yet, so Christianity hadn't started then, so that commandment was for the chosen people, the Jews. So read the Bible and have a good understanding of our religion before you try to label us all sorts of vile things and group us with Muslims and Al-Qaeda. God Bless you.

By the way, before you go on tirade against Christians and Socons, just think about the fact that most of the values that we hold dear comes from the Judeo-Christian value system (its ironic that those same values are used as a justification to persecute Christians in Canada). Perhaps you would like to go and live in Pakistan, where they have different values.
gc





Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 1698
Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4
votes: 16
Location: A Monochromatic World

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:53 pm    Post subject: Re: wrong Reply with quote

potan wrote:
um...Deuteronomy is in the old testament, and Jesus hadn't come yet, so Christianity hadn't started then, so that commandment was for the chosen people, the Jews. So read the Bible and have a good understanding of our religion before you try to label us all sorts of vile things and group us with Muslims and Al-Qaeda. God Bless you.

Perhaps you should have read my previous post before posting this...
Quote:
By the way, before you go on tirade against Christians and Socons, just think about the fact that most of the values that we hold dear comes from the Judeo-Christian value system (its ironic that those same values are used as a justification to persecute Christians in Canada).

Morals have been around a lot longer than Christianity. I'm not religious but I probably have more morals than most Christians.
Quote:
Perhaps you would like to go and live in Pakistan, where they have different values.

I'm quite happy living in a SECULAR country like Canada, thank you very much.
Paul Morrison





Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 33
Reputation: 38.1Reputation: 38.1Reputation: 38.1Reputation: 38.1
votes: 2
Location: Thunder Bay

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Neither does same sex relationships at any level. One cannot ignore part of Jesus's message while embracing others. Jesus had His choicest words for those types of individuals. Leading people down a nice and easy road to hell is idiocy.


No, his choicest words were for hypocritical religious types. Homosexuality isn't even mentioned by Jesus. Adultery is, and that's probably close enough.

What you talk about, and how often you talk about it is a good indicator of what you care about. That Jesus didn't talk much about homosexuality, but spent a good amount of time flinging condemnation on phony, self-righteous religious types is probably a good indicator that those people were more upsetting to him.

That said, I don't think he'd be on board with same-sex marriage or same sex relationships, merely that he would care less about it than he would about the people giving him a bad name for the way they talked about homosexually oriented people.
don muntean





Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 2262
Reputation: 34.9Reputation: 34.9Reputation: 34.9
votes: 8
Location: Saskatchewan

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now some people are posting silly - do your homework and -
learn!


Last edited by don muntean on Wed Jul 09, 2008 4:08 pm; edited 1 time in total
gc





Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 1698
Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4Reputation: 48.4
votes: 16
Location: A Monochromatic World

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paul Morrison wrote:
No, his choicest words were for hypocritical religious types. Homosexuality isn't even mentioned by Jesus. Adultery is, and that's probably close enough.

What you talk about, and how often you talk about it is a good indicator of what you care about. That Jesus didn't talk much about homosexuality, but spent a good amount of time flinging condemnation on phony, self-righteous religious types is probably a good indicator that those people were more upsetting to him.

That said, I don't think he'd be on board with same-sex marriage or same sex relationships, merely that he would care less about it than he would about the people giving him a bad name for the way they talked about homosexually oriented people.

Well said.
don muntean





Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Posts: 2262
Reputation: 34.9Reputation: 34.9Reputation: 34.9
votes: 8
Location: Saskatchewan

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOS ANGELES (AFP) - A US man who was born a woman before undergoing gender realignment surgery has given birth to a baby girl, US media reported.

Thomas Beatie, who is legally male but decided to keep his female sex organs during chest reconstruction surgery and testosterone therapy, attracted worldwide attention in April after revealing his pregnancy.

The 34-year-old gave birth to a baby girl at a hospital in Bend, Oregon, on June 29, People Magazine reported Thursday.

"The only thing different about me is that I can't breastfeed my baby. But a lot of mothers don't," the magazine quoted him as saying.

It said the girl is Beatie's first child, and he had given birth naturally, not by Caesarean section.

Beatie, who sports a beard, was dubbed the 'pregnant man' after appearing on Oprah Winfrey's television talkshow to discuss his pregnancy.

"I feel it's not a male or female desire to have a child. It's a human need. I'm a person and I have the right to have a biological child," he told the chat show queen.

Beatie's unusual situation first became public when he wrote an article in the leading US gay magazine The Advocate in March, entitled "Labor of Love."

"To our neighbors, my wife, Nancy, and I don't appear in the least unusual," he wrote, explaining that his wife was unable to have a child after undergoing a hysterectomy.

So he chose to become pregnant by artificial insemination, he said.

"Our situation sparks legal, political, and social unknowns," Beatie wrote, adding the couple had experienced opposition from health care professionals, friends and family.

One doctor refused to treat the couple, after consulting an ethics board.

"How does it feel to be a pregnant man? Incredible. Despite the fact that my belly is growing with a new life inside me, I am stable and confident being the man that I am," Beatie wrote.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/afp.....ransgender

:roll: :lol:
mrsocko





Joined: 29 Oct 2006
Posts: 2463
Reputation: 131.2
votes: 8
Location: Southwestern Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sheesh! How did this topic denigrate into a Christian bashing VS. fundementalist free for all.

Old Testament - rules were for that time. Many rules were written for a people roaming the desert with poor sanitation. If you can imagine a million people roaming in circles around the Sinia Penisula for 40 years you can imagine why some of the laws might seem strict. I imagine keeping law and order might have been a little hard.

New Testament - Jesus came to fufill the law not to destroy it. The law was good. It kept law and order. It stopped the spread of disease. It was becoming out dated in a more urban community like Israel at the turn of the first millenium. That didn't stop the Pharisees from forcing the Jews to keep every letter of the law. Jesus said the law was made for man not man for the law. The law said that if you broke it you must die or something died in your place. Jesus died as a sacrifice to fulfill the law.

That's why when I drink to much swear lie and all the other laws I break I don't kill a pigeon or a pig on an alter. Jesus died for all my sins past and future.

GC - Old testament needs to be seen in this context. While morality was here before Christianity our society owes some dues to the culture created by Christianity. I don't understand why you are so hostile and dismissive of it.
urbanmonk





Joined: 12 Jul 2007
Posts: 307
Reputation: 16.8Reputation: 16.8
votes: 5

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well put mrsocko!
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 2 of 3

Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next  


 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You can attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


United Church Supports Abortion???

phpBBCopyright 2001, 2005 phpBB