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Blue Meanie





Joined: 20 Oct 2006
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Location: B.C.

PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 12:12 pm    Post subject: Environmentalism=Socialism Reply with quote

Hi!
Stumbled on this op piece by Charles Krauthammer this morning. Fairly sums up my feelings on the Environtologists, validating that I'm not alone. Hopefully some others will see the light here.

Carbon Chastity
The First Commandment of the Church of the Environment

By Charles Krauthammer
Friday, May 30, 2008; Page A13

I'm not a global warming believer. I'm not a global warming denier. I'm a global warming agnostic who believes instinctively that it can't be very good to pump lots of CO2 into the atmosphere but is equally convinced that those who presume to know exactly where that leads are talking through their hats.

Predictions of catastrophe depend on models. Models depend on assumptions about complex planetary systems -- from ocean currents to cloud formation -- that no one fully understands. Which is why the models are inherently flawed and forever changing. The doomsday scenarios posit a cascade of events, each with a certain probability. The multiple improbability of their simultaneous occurrence renders all such predictions entirely speculative.

Yet on the basis of this speculation, environmental activists, attended by compliant scientists and opportunistic politicians, are advocating radical economic and social regulation. "The largest threat to freedom, democracy, the market economy and prosperity," warns Czech President Vaclav Klaus, "is no longer socialism. It is, instead, the ambitious, arrogant, unscrupulous ideology of environmentalism."

If you doubt the arrogance, you haven't seen that Newsweek cover story that declared the global warming debate over. Consider: If Newton's laws of motion could, after 200 years of unfailing experimental and experiential confirmation, be overthrown, it requires religious fervor to believe that global warming -- infinitely more untested, complex and speculative -- is a closed issue.

But declaring it closed has its rewards. It not only dismisses skeptics as the running dogs of reaction, i.e., of Exxon, Cheney and now Klaus. By fiat, it also hugely re-empowers the intellectual left.

For a century, an ambitious, arrogant, unscrupulous knowledge class -- social planners, scientists, intellectuals, experts and their left-wing political allies -- arrogated to themselves the right to rule either in the name of the oppressed working class (communism) or, in its more benign form, by virtue of their superior expertise in achieving the highest social progress by means of state planning (socialism).

Two decades ago, however, socialism and communism died rudely, then were buried forever by the empirical demonstration of the superiority of market capitalism everywhere from Thatcher's England to Deng's China, where just the partial abolition of socialism lifted more people out of poverty more rapidly than ever in human history.

Just as the ash heap of history beckoned, the intellectual left was handed the ultimate salvation: environmentalism. Now the experts will regulate your life not in the name of the proletariat or Fabian socialism but -- even better -- in the name of Earth itself.

Environmentalists are Gaia's priests, instructing us in her proper service and casting out those who refuse to genuflect. (See Newsweek above.) And having proclaimed the ultimate commandment -- carbon chastity -- they are preparing the supporting canonical legislation that will tell you how much you can travel, what kind of light you will read by, and at what temperature you may set your bedroom thermostat.

Only Monday, a British parliamentary committee proposed that every citizen be required to carry a carbon card that must be presented, under penalty of law, when buying gasoline, taking an airplane or using electricity. The card contains your yearly carbon ration to be drawn down with every purchase, every trip, every swipe.

There's no greater social power than the power to ration. And, other than rationing food, there is no greater instrument of social control than rationing energy, the currency of just about everything one does and uses in an advanced society.

So what does the global warming agnostic propose as an alternative? First, more research -- untainted and reliable -- to determine (a) whether the carbon footprint of man is or is not lost among the massive natural forces (from sunspot activity to ocean currents) that affect climate, and (b) if the human effect is indeed significant, whether the planetary climate system has the homeostatic mechanisms (like the feedback loops in the human body, for example) with which to compensate.

Second, reduce our carbon footprint in the interim by doing the doable, rather than the economically ruinous and socially destructive. The most obvious step is a major move to nuclear power, which to the atmosphere is the cleanest of the clean.

But your would-be masters have foreseen this contingency. The Church of the Environment promulgates secondary dogmas as well. One of these is a strict nuclear taboo.

Rather convenient, is it not? Take this major coal-substituting fix off the table, and we will be rationing all the more. Guess who does the rationing."
Sheila





Joined: 09 Feb 2008
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Location: Central Alberta

PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Polk Plant built in Florida was able to have almost zero harmful emissions. This is a coal burning plant. We have the damn technology, why aren't we using it?
gc





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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Allowing people to use the environment for FREE = Socialism
casper35





Joined: 05 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not sure that classic environmentalism = socialism but the modern version sure is.

More accurately todays environmentalism = anti-people
kind of like:
modern feminism = anti-male
separation of church and state = anti Christian
Human Rights Commissions = anti- free speech
multiculturalism = the promotion of identity groups and a victim mentality
accommodation = anti-western

and so forth.

It is all the result of political correctness and out-of-control progressive zealotry. Any sense of moderation or common sense was thrown out the window long ago. Like social justice, it is no longer about improving life for all citizens. It is about redistribution by forcibly removing basic rights from one group and giving them to another.
kwlafayette





Joined: 03 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, it will all end badly. Some have seen it coming for a while, others won't until it is too late. Carbon rationing, I don't think you could actually grasp what a bad idea it is until you actually had to live under that system for a while.
Mac





Joined: 02 Sep 2006
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Location: John Baird's riding...

PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great article, Blue Meanie! Thanks for posting it!!

On a somewhat related note: Harper touts nukes as solution to global warming

-Mac
Wallace





Joined: 09 May 2008
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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 7:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The kyoto protocol is a load of hog wash, like I really care if the shadowy board of appointees that have taken over europe wish to race to see who can run their country into the ground the fastest.
Cool Blue





Joined: 21 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Only Monday, a British parliamentary committee proposed that every citizen be required to carry a carbon card that must be presented, under penalty of law, when buying gasoline, taking an airplane or using electricity. The card contains your yearly carbon ration to be drawn down with every purchase, every trip, every swipe.


I recall a poster here advocating the exact same thing...
Sheila





Joined: 09 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No one else but PM Harper will be able to get the U.S., China, and India to come on board with lowering emmissions. :D The three biggest polluters. He is pure genius, watch and see if it doesn't happen. And on top of that we'll make a fare bit of coin selling uranium to the EU, lol. Thanks for the link Mac.
FF_Canuck





Joined: 02 Sep 2006
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Location: Southern Alberta

PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sheila wrote:
No one else but PM Harper will be able to get the U.S., China, and India to come on board with lowering emmissions. :D The three biggest polluters. He is pure genius, watch and see if it doesn't happen. And on top of that we'll make a fare bit of coin selling uranium to the EU, lol. Thanks for the link Mac.


While I'd prefer less endorsement of AGW in general, that would be an impressive achievement. Nuclear power makes lots of sense, even without carbon cutting as a justification. I hope we manage to stay clear of the carbon trading scheme as well.
Cool Blue





Joined: 21 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 9:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know if he could get China or India on-side but I think he has a chance at getting the US to agree to some kind of reduction. Perhaps a cap and trade system for North America (like how Mulroney convinced Regan to do the same for acid rain).
kwlafayette





Joined: 03 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that any leader worth his salt the world over, is thinking about nuclear power these days. Wind is find if you have one of the windy places on earth; but wind only produces 30% of the time under the best conditions. Solar generation matches well to demand; on the blistering days when people have the A/C cranked, solar is producing, but that is only good for peak periods. Tide has power, but not everyone has ocean. Hydro works on an industrial scale, but not everyone has appropriate rivers. In a lot of places on earth, the only credible replacement for the coal burning base load power plant is a nuclear one.

Lots of unproven theories and schemes, like storing compressed air, but nuclear works today.
mrsocko





Joined: 29 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
In a lot of places on earth, the only credible replacement for the coal burning base load power plant is a nuclear one.

Lots of unproven theories and schemes, like storing compressed air, but nuclear works today.


What about that arc reactor thingy in IRON MAN's chest. He made that out of bubble gum and shoe laces in the movie.
Cool Blue





Joined: 21 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I think that any leader worth his salt the world over, is thinking about nuclear power these days. Wind is find if you have one of the windy places on earth; but wind only produces 30% of the time under the best conditions. Solar generation matches well to demand; on the blistering days when people have the A/C cranked, solar is producing, but that is only good for peak periods. Tide has power, but not everyone has ocean. Hydro works on an industrial scale, but not everyone has appropriate rivers. In a lot of places on earth, the only credible replacement for the coal burning base load power plant is a nuclear one.

Lots of unproven theories and schemes, like storing compressed air, but nuclear works today.


Agreed, but I'd also like to see the barriers to micro-generation removed and incentives put in place.

For example, Ottawa actually has a by-law against installing solar panels on your home. The friggin city will fine you if you idle your car for more than 3 minutes, but they won't allow you to generate your own clean solar power...

One of the few good things the Ontario Liberals have done is to allow people to sell electricity back to the grid so that helps pay off the solar panels or wind turbine a lot faster.
FascistLibertarian





Joined: 23 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well the environment is messed up and getting worse. Global warming is only one small issue.
The only solutions are radical and wont happen.
What will happen is the world will get worse, things will get more expensive, and the rich will be able to pay to avoid the crummyness while everyone else will have a gradually and occasionally quickly decline in standard of living.
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