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mrsocko





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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 7:49 pm    Post subject: Do you believe in or have you ever witnessed a miracle! Reply with quote

BEAJ suggested I start a thread on this topic.

Has God performed miracles in your lives that would cause you to know that he exists?

Could you tell me about some of them? I love hearing about God moving in peoples lives.
biggie





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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Simply... no.

I've always felt that miracles are based on one's interperetation of the world; some see things as miracles that I would be more prone to believe are explainable.
Craig
Site Admin




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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My cousin was on Oprah because she had a near death experience and claims that she was being dragged to hell.

Not exactly a miracle - but interesting.
Riley W





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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My mother had pneumonia earlier in September, and she had a blot clot in her legs 4 years ago.

Anyways once getting pneumonia and a history of a blood clot the doctor put 2 and 2 together and worried about another blood clot in the lungs, because she was short on breath. They rushed her into the city for a CT scan.

They found some spot on her lungs.

She had also smoked on and off since she was a teen, she had quit for during her pregnancy with me, started again and when I was 5 and the schools were pumping in their anti-smoking campaign I lectured her and she quit, and 1 year ago I found out she was back at smoking again (hiding it, caught her).

So that got her really worried about lung cancer. She had too wait 2 weeks to go in for another test to see what it was just an inflammation or cancer.

So for 2 weeks she was getting REALLY (and I mean REALLY) Evangelical...she was reading the Bible every day, praying a lot, and made me put the Miracle Channel (evangelical Canadian channel based in Lethbridge Alberta) on for her everyday before going to school.

Anyways, what was really freaky, one day, after school while on my laptop in the living room where she was watching tv, I put on the Miracle Channel for her.

It caught my attention immediately, the Pastor said (I don`t remember perfectly) along the lines of:

"You will LIVE"

"The fluids in your throat will dry up"

"The pneumonia will be cured"

I mean it was really freaky, it was like God was sending a message to my mother.

2 weeks later she found out it was just inflamed nodules and not cancer.

I consider that a mini-miracle in my family's lives.

I don't believe what happened on the tv their was a coincidence I believe God was behind it.
theatheistjew





Joined: 31 Mar 2007
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Location: Niagara Region, Ontario

PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2007 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm with Biggie, miracles are just coincidence. Prayer may help psychologically if someone believes that they might get help from above they might be more optimistic, and I think many diseases can be battled by optimism. Many can't.
I also think that if someone knows that friends and families are praying for them, it might give them the satisfaction that they are loved and may try harder to pull through.
There have been scientific studies that give ambiguous results this way. But I do believe in mind over matter for some illnesses.

That being said, this video illustrates that prayer does not work (God does not answer prayers):
http://youtube.com/watch?v=BH0rFZIqo8A
Zak





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Every miracle has a rational explanation. People just find miracles more comforting because they can avoid taking responsibility for their own lives.

The real problem with faith healing is that it encourages people to avoid getting real treatment they need.

More:
http://www.sram.org/0802/faith-healing.html
crazymamma





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zak wrote:
Every miracle has a rational explanation. People just find miracles more comforting because they can avoid taking responsibility for their own lives.

The real problem with faith healing is that it encourages people to avoid getting real treatment they need.

More:
http://www.sram.org/0802/faith-healing.html


People just use faith healing as a way to avoid take responsibility for their own lives?

Those that refuse medical treatment are wackos as far as I am concerned.

Dude religion is ALL about taking responsibility for your life. No excuses accepted here.

Co-incidence is just another word for refusing to believe what is put in front of you. The real and steadfast loving presence of god in our lives.

I have never known anybody to refuse medical help because of belief in God. He expects you to do your part of the work all the time.

There is an old story about a man In a flood:

I will not leave my home because god will save me he states.

The weather channel tells him to evacuate but he refusing saying God will save him.

Water starts to pour into his house.

I will not leave as God will save me.

While on his roof a guy on his boat comes by and offers to take him to safety.

No I will not leave as God will save me.

Water even deeper a scuba diver comes by and offers to take him to safety.

No I will not leave God will save me.

Having to leave his roof he swims to a tree and is offered assistance by a helicopter rescue team.

I will not leave God will save me.

Finally he drowns.

At the Pearly gates he talks to GOD and asks: How could you let me die Lord, I had faith that you would save me.

God replies: Well just who do you think sent those messages on the T.V. to evacuate, the guy in the boat to save you, the scuba diver and the Helicopter rescue team?

The expectation is that one must do their part of the work too. You know that old chestnut about God helps those that help themselves.
Zak





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 7:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

8) I've never seen that joke used to justify a god's existance. Usually it's the other way around.

I also like:

Give a man a fish, he eats for a day.
Teach a man to fish, he eats for life.
Give a man religion, he starves to death while praying for a fish.

But getting back to topic, my comment on how people love to avoid responsibility was directed towards faith healing and was not a general attack on religion (we see far too many topics turn into pointless 'Do gods exist debate'). Basically people who think they can heal themselves by praying are just looking for an easy way out of their problems.

While I generally think individuals should make their own decisions regarding their health, when I'm paying for your care through my ridiculously high taxes, I want you healed as quickly as possible and so we should always discourage people from wasting time and our money on miracles and praying.
TorontoCon





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know a little about neurology.... and what happened with Kevin Everett in the NFL (Buffalo Bills TE) is really astonishing. When you get involuntary twitches like he had on the field, and then have feeling and movement of your feet a few days later, that is.... extremely, extremely rare.

He's walking now (a MONTH later). Unreal. I'm pretty sure that if you are Christian, you see that as a miracle.

As a huge NFL fan, I prayed for him every Sunday.
plantguy





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I beleive in miracles. Dion won the leadership contest didn't he?
don muntean





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've experienced a number of miracles from God [and it continues] yet these are difficult to objectively share with others - yet - there is one miracle that I've come to get objective evidence of.

This may sound odd but I've long wondered about my having suffered very serious head injuries on my forehead and - on the left and right sides of my skull.

There are inexplicable healed injuries [along with a deep fracture in my chin] - by feeling my scalp when I wash my hair - I've noted this - since childhood - they have been there for as long as I can recall.

A few of years ago I had a CT scan done of my head on the left side - where the lesser of the deep fractures are noted and sure enough - there they are in the CT scan - even my chin looks as though it was once broken! I have asked my mother about this and she says she knows nothing of it.

When did I suffer what appears to be serious head injuries and how was it healed - how did I survive? It was God!

In the Hebrew tradition there is the interpretation on a verse which says - sometimes God is looking at us through a window and sometimes through a crack in the wall - the point being that - God is with us and watching over us and sometimes we can see it [the window] and sometimes we cannot [the crack in the wall] but - He is ever-present in our lives.

99% of everyone have experienced miracles but - not everyone is looking to see them nor their cause. If one could only 'really see' [in real time] how God IS our best friend and greatest well-wisher!

mrsocko





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My wife and I had tried to have a baby for 3 years and nothing had happened. We decide to try invitro. We had been doing it for a month or so and I had been praying that God would give us a baby.

One morning as I began to pray my heart started to beat out of control and I felt God tell me to pray really hard. For the next few days I prayed harder than I had ever prayed in my life. I was sure God was telling me the Invitro was going to work. 3 days after I started praying a girl we did not know who had been talking to a friend of ours came to us and asked if we would adopt her unborn child. That boy is my son now.
Riley W





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrsocko wrote:
My wife and I had tried to have a baby for 3 years and nothing had happened. We decide to try invitro. We had been doing it for a month or so and I had been praying that God would give us a baby.

One morning as I began to pray my heart started to beat out of control and I felt God tell me to pray really hard. For the next few days I prayed harder than I had ever prayed in my life. I was sure God was telling me the Invitro was going to work. 3 days after I started praying a girl we did not know who had been talking to a friend of ours came to us and asked if we would adopt her unborn child. That boy is my son now.


wow, what an amazing miracle.

Interesting thing....me parents had 2 kids, me and my brother, my brother is 16 years older than me, my mother had been trying to have me for years and had went into treatments, because she had some follicle problem....anyways before I was born my parents went through at 5 month separation (not divorce, it wasn't money or sex either, my dad thought my mom valued her parents more than him, that type of thing), but then they started dating again, and when my mom was 38 after years of praying I was conceived.

And even after me she kept talking about adopting a Asian baby girl, lol, and she wasn't joking either, my dad wasn't interested so that didn't happen, but my mom actually did have the little pipe dream of adopting an Asian baby girl.

I think adoption is great, it gives woman who are in crisis pregnancies a reason not to abort, which is a great thing.
biggie





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TorontoCon wrote:

He's walking now (a MONTH later). Unreal. I'm pretty sure that if you are Christian, you see that as a miracle.



As a christian, perhaps...

I think about how little we really know about our own bodies and the world around us. All the time people recover from ailments they were told they would die from.

Of course, 50 years ago, polio was erradicating people all over the world; now it's been cured...

I don't buy these medical recoveries as miracles because I don't believe that our doctors know nearly enough to be so certain of outcomes; they can talk odds, but that's all they can talk..

Of course, my criteria for a miracle is exceedingly high - basically something I knew as impossible(or extremely close to) would have to happen before i would consider it a miracle.
theatheistjew





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PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

biggie wrote:
TorontoCon wrote:

He's walking now (a MONTH later). Unreal. I'm pretty sure that if you are Christian, you see that as a miracle.



As a christian, perhaps...

I think about how little we really know about our own bodies and the world around us. All the time people recover from ailments they were told they would die from.

Of course, 50 years ago, polio was erradicating people all over the world; now it's been cured...

I don't buy these medical recoveries as miracles because I don't believe that our doctors know nearly enough to be so certain of outcomes; they can talk odds, but that's all they can talk..

Of course, my criteria for a miracle is exceedingly high - basically something I knew as impossible(or extremely close to) would have to happen before i would consider it a miracle.

If God did miracles, we would see amputees grow back limbs, but God obviously doesn't want to be that obvious :twisted:
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