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RCO





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PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2016 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thibeault used the crying defence today in the legislature , poor him .

but it is pretty hard to explain how a low profile ndp mp suddenly became a high profile liberal cabinet minister at queen's park ,

the highest position he held with the ndp was Caucus chair , hardly a position that would be one a lot of people noticed . he had also been critic for small business and sports when in Ottawa as well . but the ndp pretty much give a critic position to everyone so he wasn't that high profile

than all of a sudden the provincial riding of Sudbury opens up , he wins the buy election and finds himself at queens park and than all of a sudden a front bench cabinet minister in wynne's government in a position much higher than he could of hoped to land with the ndp in Ottawa
Pissedoff





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PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

She should stick around as she is the best thing the PCs have going for them.
RCO





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PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

( instead of Wynne resigning , liberals are apparently plotting a desperate path to hold onto power with her still as leader , liberals are so focused on being in "power " this shouldn't come as a huge surprise )


Wynne's desperate election survival strategy: Hepburn


Ontario Liberals see a narrow path to victory in 2018 election


Despite being the most unpopular premier in Canada, Kathleen Wynne and "her strategists believe conditions are right for her to navigate a very narrow path to victory in the 2018 provincial election," writes Bob Hepburn.



By Bob Hepburn Politics

Thu., Nov. 24, 2016


Believe it or not, Kathleen Wynne thinks she and her Ontario Liberals still have a fighting chance to win re-election in 2018.

While it’s hard to imagine how the unpopular premier can turn around her party’s sinking fortunes over the next 18 months, Wynne and her campaign team are convinced they finally have a plan that can result in the Liberals forming at least a minority government.

It’s a desperate survival strategy that could save Wynne’s job and give some hope to Liberals who are resigned to losing the next election.

That hope is slim, though, because Wynne’s personal popularity keeps falling and now stands at 14 per cent according to one poll, making her the least popular premier in the country.

But Wynne’s strategists believe conditions are right for her to navigate a very narrow path to victory. Those conditions include a slowly improving economy, the public’s relative lack of knowledge about Conservative leader Patrick Brown and the huge increase in the number of electoral ridings in the Toronto area.


The plan is simple:

First, admit that mistakes have been made and that the government will refocus its attention on issues that really matter to voters, especially jobs, hydro rates and taxes. Voters got their first glimpse of the plan last weekend when a misty-eyed Wynne apologized for screwing up on hydro rates by letting them jump so sharply and “for not paying close enough attention to some of the daily stresses in Ontarian’s lives.”

The big test, though, is whether Wynne actually corrects her admitted “mistake” on hydro prices. An apology without serious action is useless.


Second, paint Brown as a political lightweight who can’t be trusted to control his party when it comes to protecting such social issues as gay rights, legalized abortion and a modernized sex-education curriculum.

As first reported by the Star’s Robert Benzie, Liberal campaign chief David Herle told has conducted polling that found the vast majority of Ontarians were less likely to vote for Brown if they knew he voted as a Tory federal MP to repeal same-sex marriage, wanted to reopen the abortion debate while an MP and had flip-flopped on many issues, including the sex-ed curriculum, since becoming Ontario Tory leader.

Third, focus campaign money and manpower on retaining as many of Toronto- and Ottawa-area ridings they now hold as they can. Both vote-rich regions will see an increase in ridings by 2018 as the Legislature grows to 124 seats from the current 109 seats.

Fourth, champion the Liberals as the party that’s worked to build and upgrade roads, public transit and subways with its massive $160-billion infrastructure program.

Fifth, learn a lesson from Hillary Clinton’s failed presidential bid and avoid portraying Wynne as a credible change agent and instead focus on being a steady leader with a long-range plan to balance the budget and improve economic conditions for middle-class working families. Nearly two-thirds of Ontarians say they’re eager for change, but after 13 years of Liberal rule it’s unlikely they will see Wynne as the most likely to deliver it.

At the same time as Wynne is retooling her campaign strategy, both the Conservatives and New Democrats are well advanced in their election planning.

The Tories plan to portray the Liberals as a scandal-ridden party that’s out of touch with middle-income voters. Possibly the smartest political move Brown has made since becoming leader was to march in the Toronto Pride Parade last summer. That decision sent a message to voters that Brown is trying to change the party’s image as a social-conservative backwater.

For the NDP, they believe New Democrats who voted strategically for Wynne in the 2014 election because they feared former Tory leader Tim Hudak so much will return to the party in 2018.

Remarkably, this is the fourth time in the last 10 months that Wynne has tried to launch a political reset.

The first time came in February after the Liberals were trounced in the Whitby-Oshawa byelection. The second was in June when Wynne shuffled her cabinet. The third occurred in September when she prorogued the Legislature and tabled a new throne speech promising a minor break on hydro bills.

None of these has worked — and there’s no assurance this latest effort will either. But Wynne is a fighter and has come from behind in past elections. If everything breaks right for her, 2018 might just be another one of those times.

Bob Hepburn's column appears Thursday. bhepburn@thestar.ca

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorials/2016/11/24/wynnes-desperate-election-survival-strategy-hepburn.html
RCO





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PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pissedoff wrote:
She should stick around as she is the best thing the PCs have going for them.



what gets me is her personal popularity in her riding of Don Valley West , which historically was one of the most pc ridings in all of Toronto , its not a liberal stronghold in the sense , it had even went cpc federally in 2011 and one of there better ridings in the 416 .yet she remains oddly popular there , she's never got less than 50 % of the vote there , and she even went up and did better in 2011 a year when other ridings were much closer and better for the pc's , she also fought off a strong challenge from John Tory in 2007 .
I have a hard time explaining why she is so popular in what should be a much more competitive riding in Toronto , the federal cpc were getting between 19,000 -20,000 votes there ( 2008-2015) but provincially last 2 elections pc's only got 12,000- 14,000

as unpopular as she is in many regions of Ontario she remains oddly popular in parts of Toronto
RCO





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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

( despite the win in Ottawa Vanier , liberal fortunes in Ontario continue to get worse by the day , wynne's approval rating now 13 % , the lowest ever recorded for a sitting premier )


PCs Continue to Lead Strongly in Ontario

November 25, 2016 @ 6:00 AM | Filed under: Ontario

PCs Continue to Lead Strongly in Ontario

Kathleen Wynne’s approvals lower than ever

TORONTO November 23rd – In a random sampling of public opinion taken by the Forum Poll™ among 1184 Ontario voters, the plurality, more than 4-in-10, will vote for the Progressive Conservatives if a provincial election were held today (43%), while just one quarter would vote either for the Liberals or the NDP (24% each). Relatively few would vote Green (8%) or for another party (2%). The PCs post their largest vote share in the 905 area code surrounding Toronto (47%), the Liberals do best in the Toronto city limits (28%) and the NDP have their biggest share in Northern Ontario (29%).

PCs on track for supermajority

If these results were projected up to seats in the current 107 seat Legislature, the PCs would take a supermajority, or 70 seats, while the NDP would take 26 seats. The liberals would take just 11.

Kathleen Wynne’s favourables are lower still

The Premier has the approval of just more than one tenth of voters (13%) and this is the lowest value we have ever recorded for a sitting premier. Her net favourable score (approve minus disapprove) is an astoundingly negative -60. Four-in-ten Liberals approve of her (43%), but one third disapproves (33%).

PC leader Patrick Brown has the approval of close to 3-in-10 (28%), and the disapproval of just less than a quarter (23%) which gives him a net score of +5. Half the voters don’t know enough about him to take a position (49%). One half his party approves of him (49%) and one sixth disapprove (15%), but more than a third don’t know enough about him to judge (36%).

Andrea Horwath has the best approval rating of the party leaders (36%) and her net score is a relatively positive +11. She has the approval of two thirds of her party’s voters (65%). Even so, she prompts high levels of “don’t knows” (39% in total, 23% among New Democrats).

Brown seen to make best premier

Patrick Brown scores the highest of the party leaders at being Premier, with just one quarter of the vote (26%), and he is almost tied with “none of the above” (24%). Then comes Andrea Horwath, with a fifth of the vote (19%) and Kathleen Wynne with about one tenth (12%). One fifth don’t offer an opinion (19%).

Just one quarter are small “c” conservatives

Just one quarter of Ontario voters describe themselves as “small “c” conservatives” (27%), while more than 4-in-10 say they are not (42%). Three-in-ten aren’t sure if they are (31%). Being a conservative is common to the oldest (33%), males (33%) rather than females (21%), mid income groups ($60K to $80K - 37%) and in Northern Ontario (30%). Among PCs, just half say they are “small “c” conservatives” (54%), and close to one fifth say they are not (18%). Among Liberals and New Democrats, about one tenth claim conservative tendencies (11% and 12%, respectively).

High approval for legal abortion, same -ex marriage, less for sex education curriculum

Seven-in-ten approve both of legalized abortion (70%) and same sex marriage (71%), and this is the case even among PCs (63% and 62%, respectively), Liberals (75% and 80%, respectively) and New Democrats (84% and 79%, respectively). As well, there is majority approval for these two positions among small “c” conservatives (69% and 67%, respectively). It is only with respect to Ontario’s sex education curriculum that there is less consensus. One half approve of it (52%) while one third do not (33%) and one sixth don’t know (15%). Among PCs, one half disapprove (48%), while just more than one third approve (37%). Among Liberals and New Democrats, approval is higher than disapproval (64% and 67%, respectively). Small ‘“c” conservatives are exactly split on the issue (44% approve, 43% disapprove).

“It would appear that the traditional social value issues of abortion and equal marriage will have little ideological purchase in an Ontario election, but the more recent and widely publicized furor over the sex education curriculum might find some traction, at least among PC voters. It will not fly as far among Liberals and New Democrats though, nor even among those who describe themselves as ideological conservatives,” said Forum Research President, Dr. Lorne Bozinoff.

Lorne Bozinoff, Ph.D. is the president and founder of Forum Research. He can be reached at lbozinoff@forumresearch.com or at (416) 960-9603.

http://poll.forumresearch.com/.....n-ontario/
RCO





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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

( who is this reporter ? talk about out to lunch ? , but I admit the opposition has been very harsh to Mr Thibeault but the Ontario liberals deserve no sympathy and have been surrounded by lies and scandals since day one , this party has taken politics in Ontario to a new low and deserves to be thrown to the trash )


The new corruption of Ontario politics: Cohn


Forget the facts. Criminalizing an incumbent party is now a proven path to power.


Liberal MPP Glenn Thibeault said many in Sudbury — New Democrats and Liberals — urged him to demand a cabinet job to run in the 2015 byelectgion, but he thought better of it, writes Martin Regg Cohn.


By Martin Regg CohnOntario Politics Columnist

Thu., Nov. 24, 2016


We need more good people in public life.

They pay a heavy price for a thankless job. But we’ll all pay a price if they eventually say, no thanks.

Keep treating dedicated politicians as undeserving and we’ll ultimately get the politicians we deserve.

Exhibit A for the kind of people we need to attract to politics — and the perils they face in public life — is Glenn Thibeault, Ontario’s minister of energy.

Before entering politics, he ran the United Way in Sudbury. Before that, group homes for people with autism.

That’s more than most of us will ever do by way of good works. We need more like him, but only a fool would follow in his footsteps after what he’s gone through lately.

Politics is not for the faint-hearted. Yet you’d need a heart of stone not to feel his pain.

Today, Thibeault stands accused of corruption. Accused, but not charged.

Presumed innocent until proven guilty? No, it’s reversed.

Presumed guilty without the chance to proclaim his innocence in a court of law.

To call his situation Kafkaesque would be an understatement. Such reckless cries of corruption are a perversion of our democracy — disgracing our political system and discrediting our legal system.

To watch the opposition, police and prosecutors weaponizing the law — lobbing firebombs into the legislature — is a dispiriting spectacle.

Coming so soon after Donald Trump’s demonization and the FBI’s recriminalization of Hillary Clinton in the U.S. presidential campaign — and his Post-election admission that the charges were trumped up, just play-acting — we should know better by now. But for the opposition, criminalizing an incumbent party is now a proven path to power.

When I sat down with Thibeault this week, he choked up describing what it’s like to tell his two young children that he has done nothing wrong, just as he teared up in an earlier encounter with reporters. On Wednesday, the opposition Progressive Conservatives mocked his words and tears in the legislature.

Thibeault doesn’t feel sorry for himself. But he feels guilty, far from home, that family members are now in the line of fire.

The so-called scandal in Sudbury is a long and twisted tale, covered at length elsewhere in the pages of the Star. A Liberal staffer, Pat Sorbara, has been charged — not under the Criminal Code (the charges wouldn’t stick), but a never-used section of the Election Act, a provincial offence — with trying to bribe him to run in a 2015 Sudbury byelection. Sorbara is also charged with trying to induce a previously defeated Liberal candidate to step aside for Thibeault (even though the premier had already declared she wouldn’t sign his nomination papers).

The opposition wants Thibeault’s resignation, arguing that a minister who stands accused should not sit in cabinet until clearing his name. Would that he could — but he can’t, actually.

Thanks to a bizarre loophole in the law, Sorbara is charged with allegedly bribing Thibeault, but he isn’t being charged for supposedly seeking one. Moreover, Thibeault has never been told precisely what he is accused of.

Nor will Thibeault ever have an opportunity to defend himself in a court of law with his own legal counsel, which introduces another form of jeopardy. Let us suppose that when Sorbara has her day in court, she offers an unpersuasive defence, or that she is an unlikeable defendant, leading a judge to convict her. Does that mean Thibeault should go down on account of another’s alleged transgressions or weak defences?

In our system, one defends oneself. One doesn’t depend on others to clear one’s name.

Thibeault tells me that many in Sudbury — New Democrats and Liberals — urged him to demand a cabinet job to run, but he thought better of it. Thibeault insists he asked only to be considered in future if he proved himself a worthy backbencher.

No matter. We now live in a province where prosecutors and police conduct investigations into conversations that are part of the normal give and take of politics — not to be confused with politicians on the take.

Recall how Progressive Conservative Leader Patrick Brown rewarded a sitting MPP, Garfield Dunlop, for resigning his riding so that Brown could run in a byelection last year. Dunlop was promptly placed on the party payroll. An inducement worthy of a police probe?

It turns out that the Election Act prohibits only inducements to persuade or dissuade people from running. It doesn’t ban bribes for anyone to give up their seat. Not exactly a logical loophole.

In truth, the Election Act was intended to stop powerful people or corporations from getting their way by bribing politicians to get out of the way. Not to prevent political parties from recruiting the best people to win elections, while persuading likely losers to leave quietly (as happened in Sudbury).

Of course, there is another way to clear the air. The premier could call a Royal Commission of Inquiry into Impropriety, summoning the leaders and MPPs from all three parties — under oath — to testify about the conversations, inducements, resignations, paycheques, and other tricks of the trade practiced on all sides.

Or the opposition could spare us from such a waste of time and money, after having plunged us into a wild OPP goose chase: They could offer a public apology for the hypocrisy of relying on the police to do their dirty work, when everyone — especially voters — knows that all sides are guilty of similar sins.

Politicians who live in glass legislative chambers shouldn’t throw stones, lest voters say: A pox on all your parties.

And who will run for public office then?

https://www.thestar.com/news/queenspark/2016/11/24/the-new-corruption-of-ontario-politics-cohn.html
RCO





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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

despite the shockingly low approval ratings for Kathleen Wynne there is other parts to this poll which are interesting

Kathleen Wynne Approval
Do you approve or disapprove of the job Kathleen Wynne is doing as premier?

Total Sample 1184 Approve 13 Disapprove 73 Don't know 14


some province wide numbers

Province wide PC - 43 , Lib 24 , NDP 24 , green 8

Eastern - PC 40 , Lib 27 , NDP 21 , green 11

416 - PC 40 , LIB 28 , NDP 27 , green 3

905 - PC 47 , LIB 22 , NDP 22 , green 7

GTA - PC 45 , LIB 24 , NDP 24 , green 6

SW ont - PC 41 , LIB 24 , NDP 24 , green 2

North - PC 42 , LIB 18 , NDP 29 , green 9



( one thing I find interesting is there numbers for eastern Ontario don't seem to match the Ottawa vanier by election results much , they have the ndp and greens much higher than what they got and if the green's really were at 11% they would of done better in a riding like Ottawa Vanier .

its also stands out to me that the pc's seem to be doing really well in areas they don't have many seats and aren't used to winning like 416 , GTA and northern Ontario , but some of the areas they have a lot of seats like SW ont and eastern numbers aren't up that much , it appears there likely to hold what they already have and are many possible ridings all over the province they could possibly pick up

this poll also has the pc's leading in the 416 , which is not something we are used to seeing and more really bad news for Kathleen Wynne )


http://poll.forumresearch.com/.....Release%20(2016%2011%2023).pdf
RCO





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PostPosted: Sat Nov 26, 2016 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

( despite dismally low approval numbers , wynne isn't resigning , in fact she is going on trade missions instead , this week to asia )



Wynne embarking on business mission to Japan and South Korea

Wynne
Ontario Premier Kathleen Wynne in Kingston, Ont., on March 31, 2016. (THE Canadian PRESS IMAGES/Lars Hagberg)



The Canadian Press
Published Saturday, November 26, 2016 10:09AM EST



TORONTO -- Ontario Premier Kathleen Wynne leaves today for a business mission to Japan and South Korea.

The premier says the purpose of the mission is to generate business agreements that will "increase trade, spur investment in Ontario and create jobs."

Wynne and the delegation of 45 business leaders and academics from Ontario will travel to Tokyo, Nagoya, Japan and Seoul.

Japan is Ontario's fifth-largest trading partner, with two-way trade topping $11 billion last year.

Trade between Ontario and South Korea was nearly $6 billion last year.

The trip is set to wrap up on Friday.

http://www.cp24.com/world/wynn.....-1.3178092
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most ontario voters think Wynne should resign - poll

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