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will mcguinty leave as liberal leader before next provincial election
yes
16%
 16%  [ 1 ]
no
83%
 83%  [ 5 ]
Total Votes : 6

Author Message
RCO





Joined: 02 Mar 2009
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votes: 3
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:06 am    Post subject: Will McGuinty be the third to leave ? Reply with quote

Will McGuinty be the third?
By JOHN SNOBELEN


A year and a half ago I wondered if any of the party leaders would be around for the next provincial election. The answer to that question is becoming clearer.

The NDP's Howard Hampton has packed it in, leaving his party in the hands of Andrea Horwath.

John Tory has finally met his political demise and the Conservatives will select a new leader over the next few months.

The only remaining question is will Dalton McGuinty lead the Liberals in a quest for a third term?

A few months ago the answer seemed obvious. McGuinty was basically unchallenged and having declined the honour of contesting the federal Liberal leadership, he seemed destined to be premier for a long time.

But the times they are a changing.

Those who head governments fall into two broad groups; managers and leaders. Leaders are the advocates for real and substantial change. They are rare in the corporate boardroom and rarer still around the cabinet table. We all are just a little more comfortable in the company of managers.

Managers are the agents of marginal improvement. They resist change. They are the folks who calm the waters and keep the ship sailing on a predictable course. So when the province seems to be going in a reasonable direction we elect managers to guide things along. But when the direction is obviously wrong we elect a leader to set a new course.

Mike Harris was a leader. His message in 1995 was clear and succinct; Ontario needed to go in a new direction. His government, particularly in the early years, was willing to embrace turmoil because it was committed to fundamental change.

Dalton McGuinty is a manager. His government has been masterful at keeping the water still. A hallmark of his government has been an aversion to controversy. McGuinty has been more than happy to throw money at every interest group to avoid conflict.

The comments of his education minister during the recent non-negotiations with the elementary teachers are instructive. The ministers stated goal was to find "peace in the sector." Finding a good value for the taxpayer was clearly a secondary consideration.

All of that is fine -- in good times. But in the middle of a recession with the government about to break the deficit record set by NDP premier Bob Rae -- whose budget set the stage for the Harris revolution -- paying off interest groups may not be such a great strategy.

McGuinty is suddenly politically vulnerable. His government has been preoccupied with "solving" non-issues with unenforceable laws. Remember banning pit bulls, freezing sushi, and limiting the number of passengers a teenager can drive with?

In good times, avoiding the serious issues while appearing busy with the mundane might be a good strategy. When the economy is good and jobs are plentiful people might just roll their eyes and mutter something about government. But these are not good times.

While McGuinty has fiddled the province has burned.

As he fought with the federal finance minister and condemned the record of the Harris government the province slid into have-not status.

And so as it becomes more obvious that the province needs to go in a different direction the tolerance for a manager -- who is still desperately throwing money in the water hoping to calm the sea -- will diminish.

The public has little patience with a government that has spent so much to buy so little. McGuinty is a good politician and he can feel the tide turning.

Don't be surprised if he abandons the ship.

http://www.ottawasun.com/Comme.....6-sun.html
cosmostein





Joined: 04 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If he gets kicked to the curb, or leaves with grace it will really depend on how the Ontario voter takes to the new leader of the Progressive Conservative Party.

If the Liberals find themselves trailing in the polls after Hudak takes the reigns of the party, then its very possible they try and counter the new leader bump with one of their own.
ezbeatz





Joined: 09 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cosmostein wrote:
If he gets kicked to the curb, or leaves with grace it will really depend on how the Ontario voter takes to the new leader of the Progressive Conservative Party.

If the Liberals find themselves trailing in the polls after Hudak takes the reigns of the party, then its very possible they try and counter the new leader bump with one of their own.


But who's going to replace him? Finance minister Duncan who ran Ontario's largest deficit? Sobara isn't exactly charismatic. I don't know, it's not like the Liberals have a lot of talent.
cosmostein





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PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Off the top of my head?

Paul Szabo comes to mind, or Steve Mahoney.
I tend to agree the current roster is tainted so why not reach federally or into the past?
DavidK





Joined: 22 Nov 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cosmostein wrote:
Off the top of my head?

Paul Szabo comes to mind, or Steve Mahoney.
I tend to agree the current roster is tainted so why not reach federally or into the past?


Szabo? Really? Well at least he's not a total loon. Although, I sometimes wonder how he could still be Liberal in this day and age.
cosmostein





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PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DavidK wrote:
cosmostein wrote:
Off the top of my head?

Paul Szabo comes to mind, or Steve Mahoney.
I tend to agree the current roster is tainted so why not reach federally or into the past?


Szabo? Really? Well at least he's not a total loon. Although, I sometimes wonder how he could still be Liberal in this day and age.


The Tom Wappel's, Joe Comuzzi's and Brenda Chamberlain's of the Liberal Party of the past are gone.

Szabo seems to be perhaps the lone wolf in the right of center stable within the Federal Liberal Party.

He is well respected, and no one can question the guys work ethic as an MP.
And I can't imagine he is still not burning over the attempt to bounce him from his own riding in 2004 when the party "unofficially" tried to get Charles Sousa into that riding and pitch Mr. Szabo out.

If the Liberals are going to pitch Dalton they need a steady hand that is free of the issues that will dog the Provincial Liberals moving forward.

It also allows Szabo to walk away from the Federal Liberals as a six time winner from a riding that the Conservatives have heavily targeted since 2004, and walk into a cakewalk Provincial riding (and also bounce MPP Charles Sousa out or over in the process)

The reality is the center is going to vote Liberal, Dalton won in 2007 because the right stayed home, they need to challenge the Tories on their ground and perhaps Szabo can look like the elder statesman when standing on a stage beside Hudak?
DavidK





Joined: 22 Nov 2008
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Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cosmostein wrote:
DavidK wrote:
cosmostein wrote:
Off the top of my head?

Paul Szabo comes to mind, or Steve Mahoney.
I tend to agree the current roster is tainted so why not reach federally or into the past?


Szabo? Really? Well at least he's not a total loon. Although, I sometimes wonder how he could still be Liberal in this day and age.


The Tom Wappel's, Joe Comuzzi's and Brenda Chamberlain's of the Liberal Party of the past are gone.

Szabo seems to be perhaps the lone wolf in the right of center stable within the Federal Liberal Party.

He is well respected, and no one can question the guys work ethic as an MP.
And I can't imagine he is still not burning over the attempt to bounce him from his own riding in 2004 when the party "unofficially" tried to get Charles Sousa into that riding and pitch Mr. Szabo out.

If the Liberals are going to pitch Dalton they need a steady hand that is free of the issues that will dog the Provincial Liberals moving forward.

It also allows Szabo to walk away from the Federal Liberals as a six time winner from a riding that the Conservatives have heavily targeted since 2004, and walk into a cakewalk Provincial riding (and also bounce MPP Charles Sousa out or over in the process)

The reality is the center is going to vote Liberal, Dalton won in 2007 because the right stayed home, they need to challenge the Tories on their ground and perhaps Szabo can look like the elder statesman when standing on a stage beside Hudak?


I think what really gets me about Paul Szabo is that I have always heard he is a man of ethics and principles and all that. I mean you saw him rip into anything in PM Mulroney’s favour as far as the Ethics Committee went re the Mulroney-Schreiber affair.

Where was Paul with this zealous attack-dog nature when his own party was shifting beneath him and its leaders were stealing from and hurting Canadians left and right?
Rusty Bedsprings





Joined: 06 Dec 2008
Posts: 1629

votes: 5

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobody ever leaves without being defeated :roll:
RCO





Joined: 02 Mar 2009
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Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ezbeatz wrote:
cosmostein wrote:
If he gets kicked to the curb, or leaves with grace it will really depend on how the Ontario voter takes to the new leader of the Progressive Conservative Party.

If the Liberals find themselves trailing in the polls after Hudak takes the reigns of the party, then its very possible they try and counter the new leader bump with one of their own.


But who's going to replace him? Finance minister Duncan who ran Ontario's largest deficit? Sobara isn't exactly charismatic. I don't know, it's not like the Liberals have a lot of talent.


well there isn't an obvivous challenger , a leadership race would resemble the one had by the ontario pc party in 2002 , and sure a number of mpp's and maybe former mp's would be in the running .

such an idea is purely speclative at this point ,there is no way to know for sure what mcguinty might do . he definity won't leave rate away but if he left sometime before 2011 i wouldn't be that shocked , heard of some unrest within his caucus , plus the massive deficit and poor economy ( espceially in many liberal held ridings like windsor/ south western ontario , northern ontario , st catherines/ niagara ) .
RCO





Joined: 02 Mar 2009
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Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rusty Bedsprings wrote:
Nobody ever leaves without being defeated :roll:


harris left without being defeated , so did chretien and mulroney .
Rusty Bedsprings





Joined: 06 Dec 2008
Posts: 1629

votes: 5

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

correction: Not many people leave before being defeated and I don't think that Mcguilty is any exception.
SFrank85





Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2269
Reputation: 59.8
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Location: Toronto - Scarborough Southwest

PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hell, keep it in the family… David McGuinty.

It looks like George Smitherman is the real person in charge of the Ontario Liberal government.
RCO





Joined: 02 Mar 2009
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votes: 3
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rusty Bedsprings wrote:
correction: Not many people leave before being defeated and I don't think that Mcguilty is any exception.


its tough to say , he's been in politics for a while and really wanted the job .

but he is facing some unrest from his own party , many behind closed doors were avidly against the idea to harmonise the pst / gst , fearing a public backlash . and there has been signs of caucus unrest the last year or so , remember reading an article about it , where there had been some real problems during one caucus meeting a while back .
i'm just not sure how long there government can hold togther , as much of its security was based around the other 2 main parties being in trouble and having leaders who could not win or appeal to the public .
Rusty Bedsprings





Joined: 06 Dec 2008
Posts: 1629

votes: 5

PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2009 8:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rco wrote:
Quote:
its tough to say , he's been in politics for a while and really wanted the job .

but he is facing some unrest from his own party , many behind closed doors were avidly against the idea to harmonise the pst / gst , fearing a public backlash . and there has been signs of caucus unrest the last year or so , remember reading an article about it , where there had been some real problems during one caucus meeting a while back .
i'm just not sure how long there government can hold togther , as much of its security was based around the other 2 main parties being in trouble and having leaders who could not win or appeal to the public .


well if Mcguilty runs again, I might vote for him because of his animal protection bill. If he does not run then I'll almost automatically go blue.
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