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What kind of abortion law would you support? |
A law that bans all abortions (which will never pass the Supreme Court) |
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12% |
[ 4 ] |
A compromise law that would outlaw all abortions past the first trimester |
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25% |
[ 8 ] |
A law like Britans (abortions within 22 weeks) |
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18% |
[ 6 ] |
Status Quo. More abortions good. Less abortions bad |
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15% |
[ 5 ] |
Abortion only if needed to save the mother's life |
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25% |
[ 8 ] |
Abortion only for victims of sexual assault or incest |
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3% |
[ 1 ] |
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Total Votes : 32 |
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Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | The point is not to extend the 'right to life' to any and all people who want to make this claim on behalf of mute embryos, but rather to understand how the 'viability' of a woman's life depends upon an exersize of bodily autonomy and on social conditions that enable that autonomy
Judith Butler |
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 3:54 pm Post subject: abortion |
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abortion is baaaad says bah bah black sheep. I think that if the mother wants to kill the baby we should wait till the baby can speak and then ask it if it would like us to kill it. Of cource it is only fair if the gov funded the babys needs up to that point. if the kid chose to die then the mom does not have to pay the gov back, but if the kid decids to let us kill him then its the govs fault and so it should bear the fiscal burden of keeping the child alive untill it could make the decition. |
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ezbeatz

Joined: 09 Oct 2008
Posts: 1140
      votes: 10
Location: Vaughan, ON
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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Looking at the results, we're pretty evenly split. I think most people in Canada would support the 22-week option. |
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 4:38 pm Post subject: |
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ezbeatz wrote: | Looking at the results, we're pretty evenly split. I think most people in Canada would support the 22-week option. |
I think that even more folks would be on board for the 22 week option if a portion of their paychecks weren't stolen to pay for those abortions that they disagree with. If all medically unnecessary abortions were paid for with private monies, I could see a more live and let live attitude develop. |
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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I picked the "past the first trimester" option. From what I've learned in reading up on child development within the womb, I believe that we have an unborn child that is very close to a newborn baby by the beginning of the 2nd Trimester. At this point, we have a beating heart, brainwave activity, and a unborn child with the basic human form and features of a newborn baby only on a far smaller scale.
I personally dislike all elective abortions, but I have to admit that the science on the matter is murky within the 1st Trimester - it really is a matter of personal moral belief whether or not an unborn child in the 1st Trimester deserves the same basic rights and protections that a newborn baby are afforded. However, I see the science on the matter being pretty firm and conclusive as it pertains to 2nd trimester and beyond elective abortions.
However, I am flexible here. I've heard child viability suggested as a legal cutoff point, and I'd certainly take that over the status quo. |
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 8:08 pm Post subject: |
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Abortion debates always attract the most passionate attacks against the opposing side. I am on the pro-choice side, and I'd definitely like a law, so that people know what the rules actually are. Because when we have a set of rules we can actually enforce them.
I favor the viability clause, if anything because at least by then you know there's a great chance of the kid surviving. going about systematically attempting to keep every aborted foetus alive would be, from a cold-hearted money point of view, an inefficient use of medical resources.
If public financing is an issue, then state that the first one is on the public (we all make mistakes) and any further ones will be charged at full price unless there's a police report (rape, under the influence, etc) or proof of contraceptive failure. Since this point isn't very practical, bring contraceptives and proper sex ed to the public. If we aren't prepared to prevent it we can't shy away from footing the bill.
Some women make the mistake and choose to have abortions because at a later time they'll be able to afford the kid a greater amount of attention and a better lifestyle (e.g. they'll be further in their careers). Try going through a year at university pregnant, and a mother from then...
As for abortions due to genetic defects I will concede to forbidding them ONLY when I will see free, quick and accessible genetic tests for couples and individuals and FREE pre-implantation screening. No-one will persuade me that the world is filled with good samaritans who will adopt any and every baby, no matter the genetic make-up. I run on the assumption that virtue is an exception. I believe that certain gene mutations causing disease should be gradually phased out of the human gene pool. Prevention at the source (couple genetic tests) is the best option.
I'll end on a more psych note. If we ban all abortions, we take choice away. When they feel they have no choice, human beings tend to do very stupid things. |
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:08 pm Post subject: abortion |
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it has been proved that a baby as soon as six weeks from conception can feel pain. Now you tell me, takeing this last bit of relitively new info (last year or so) as true that under any circumstances killing the baby could be morally right. I am pro choice, the babys choice that is. once the baby is old enough to speek see if he/she wants to kill themselves. Let the baby decide. |
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Cole
Joined: 19 Oct 2008
Posts: 12
 
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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Having abortions available lowers the long-term crime rate. That's the main reason why I support it. |
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Mac

Joined: 02 Sep 2006
Posts: 5500
  votes: 35
Location: John Baird's riding...
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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Cole wrote: | Having abortions available lowers the long-term crime rate. That's the main reason why I support it. |
Can you cite any research to verify that assertion?
-Mac |
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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lucamanfredi wrote: | Abortion debates always attract the most passionate attacks against the opposing side. I am on the pro-choice side, and I'd definitely like a law, so that people know what the rules actually are. Because when we have a set of rules we can actually enforce them.
I favor the viability clause, if anything because at least by then you know there's a great chance of the kid surviving. going about systematically attempting to keep every aborted foetus alive would be, from a cold-hearted money point of view, an inefficient use of medical resources.
If public financing is an issue, then state that the first one is on the public (we all make mistakes) and any further ones will be charged at full price unless there's a police report (rape, under the influence, etc) or proof of contraceptive failure. Since this point isn't very practical, bring contraceptives and proper sex ed to the public. If we aren't prepared to prevent it we can't shy away from footing the bill.
Some women make the mistake and choose to have abortions because at a later time they'll be able to afford the kid a greater amount of attention and a better lifestyle (e.g. they'll be further in their careers). Try going through a year at university pregnant, and a mother from then...
As for abortions due to genetic defects I will concede to forbidding them ONLY when I will see free, quick and accessible genetic tests for couples and individuals and FREE pre-implantation screening. No-one will persuade me that the world is filled with good samaritans who will adopt any and every baby, no matter the genetic make-up. I run on the assumption that virtue is an exception. I believe that certain gene mutations causing disease should be gradually phased out of the human gene pool. Prevention at the source (couple genetic tests) is the best option.
I'll end on a more psych note. If we ban all abortions, we take choice away. When they feel they have no choice, human beings tend to do very stupid things. |
Luca, that is the most wishy washy gobbly feel good goop I have heard in a long time my man.
The first one is a free bee? Give me a break already, if you think it is important that women are allowed to use the big eraser you or your like minded friends PAY FOR IT. If the mother is not going to die it is as necessary as a freaking botox session or lypo. Its a vanity surgery at best and I resent money taken out of my pocket, out of my family's pocket, mouth for such a frivolous self absorbed procedure that is in no way medically necessary.
I personally only agree with abortion if the mother is under threat of death, but in deference to my Libertarian leanings I am not willing to push that on others, but please stop forcing me to participate/be complicite in the mindless soulless execution of millions of innocent children. YOU HAVE NO RIGHT. |
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Cole
Joined: 19 Oct 2008
Posts: 12
 
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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Ever read the book "freakonomics", the author gives an interesting perspective, on the connection
Here's the wikipedia page with links to some of those studies:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L......27s_study |
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Craig
Site Admin

Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 4415
      votes: 36
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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If we rounded up everyone who committed a crime and sterilized them it would probably lower the long term crime rate too (given the genetic link identified to crime). Heck - why sterilize them. Let's just kill them with all of our concealed weapons. |
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Cole
Joined: 19 Oct 2008
Posts: 12
 
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 9:52 pm Post subject: |
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yeah, but i t makes me more comfortable with my pro-choice position, knowing the link. |
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Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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Craig wrote: |
If we rounded up everyone who committed a crime and sterilized them it would probably lower the long term crime rate too (given the genetic link identified to crime). Heck - why sterilize them. Let's just kill them with all of our concealed weapons. |
Now THAT was a funny bit of sarcasm. :P :twisted: |
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Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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Your forgot one option.... legalizing them all |
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