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RCO





Joined: 02 Mar 2009
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Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bugs wrote:
This isn't a wage increase that's based on anything having to do with economics. TC dismisses the impact, based on what? The same sneering, factless expression of attitude that he give us so regularly?

This is an exercise in buying votes. Plain and simple. And it isn't a small raise. If you work a 40 hour week, it's $100 a week. Even so, minimum wage people will end up being even further away from the goal of having a minimum wage that allows the worker to support a family.

I would imagine that it won't affect all businesses equally, but retail stores often feel they have to stay open as part of their service. They may go from 3 clerks to 2 for most of the week, or something like that. Stores in retail malls have their hours set by the lessee so closing on Monday and Tuesday isn't a solution. But laying the worst worker off probably is.

There are whole sections of the economy that run on minimum wages. There is the agricultural sector, in which case, the raises will mostly go to migrant workers. Did they think of that?

But the thing our dim-bulb Liberal fails to notice -- probably because he doesn't have employees -- is that this will initiate a movement upwards of the whole pay scale. If the minimum wage is $14, what happens to the people presently making $14 an hour? They'll want another $2.40 an hour, and while you're at it, why not round it up to $2.80? The unions will use that as a baseline, and try to get more. Everything will get more expensive. The bottom level will get the $2.40 an hour, but the supervisor will get $3.60 an hour more, and his/her supervisor will get $8000 a year more, and so it goes. Civil servants will say What's up with that? Staruck's has raised the price of muffins and we're not going to Timmie's! We need more.. They always want more.

But none of them will be producing more.

So we will have the same number of commodities -- maybe less -- for sale, and more money wanting to buy those commodities. That's the classic pop definition of inflation.
I would say that any government -- or central bank, either -- that encourages inflation as a social policy is impoverishing their population. The people will need more money just to stay even.

It'll be a stab in the back for retirees or people living on fixed incomes.

In other words, all the economic considerations say this is bad policy. If it worked, why would they stop at $14? Why not go to $25? It's because is doesn't work that they don't do that.

Inflation is a tax on savings. And that will be the final effect.




I'm left wondering if this was about buying votes ? or an attempt to neutralise a segment of potential ndp voters ( as they had been calling for a $15 wage for some time ) and wynne saw this as a way to take a potentially popular ( popular among young millennials who work these jobs) piece of policy away from the ndp ?


and on that front perhaps this was a victory for the liberals over the ndp as the issue is now no longer one the ndp owns and leaves the provincial ndp searching for another issue to win over low income voters


also the typical minimum wage earner would strike me as difficult to get out to the ballot box anyways ? ( generally younger and often not the type deeply interested in local politics ) and now that they already have there raise , isn't much incentive to show up to vote and none of the 3 main parties are campaigning on taking away the raise


but overall the typical person if your not a minimum wage earner yourself , doesn't gain anything from this change and in fact stands to lose money and spend more time standing in line .
I always though the purpose of government policy was to provide some benefit to the general public but this policy seems to provide nothing and generally leaves the population worse off , with the exception of the small % of the working people earning minimum wage who now take home a bit more $
RCO





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PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jan. 1 minimum wage hike hitting small business hard, says owner


The sharp increase in Ontario's minimum wage has cost eight of Marc Kobrosli's employees their jobs and means customers of his dry cleaning service will pay 10 per cent more, he says.


Dave Battagello, Windsor Star Dave Battagello, Windsor Star

Published on: December 29, 2017 | Last Updated: December 29, 2017 6:58 PM EST


Marc Kobrosli, owner of Blondie Cleaners, is shown at his Windsor business on Dec. 13, 2017. Dan Janisse / Windsor Star


A sharp increase in Ontario’s minimum wage has already cost eight of Marc Kobrosli’s employees their jobs and means customers of his dry cleaning service will pay 10 per cent more, he says.

On Jan. 1, Ontario’s minimum wage will jump from $11.60 to $14 an hour. In 2019, it will go up another $1 as a result of the Fair Workplaces, Better Jobs Act (also known as Bill 148), which makes significant changes to the province’s labour laws.

Small business owners are being “thrown in the deep end” by the sudden minimum wage increase, said Kobrosli, the owner of Blondie’s Cleaners in Windsor.

A sign on the countertop at his business tells customers that a 10 per cent across-the-board price increase is solely due to Bill 148. Kobrosli also blames the legislation for his decision to lay off eight employees and close Blondie’s outlets in LaSalle and Amherstburg earlier this year.

He still has 24 full-time and seven part-time workers — most of whom make minimum wage.


“It was money I had to save in wages just for preparation of what was going to happen in January,” Kobrosli said of the staff reduction. “I closed those two locations to soften the blow.”

The domino effect is fewer customers from LaSalle and Amherstburg, which means prices have to go up, he said. “It’s a double-edged sword. I love my employees. They deserve $25 an hour if I could afford it.”

But the minimum wage increase should have been phased in over five years, said Kobrosli. “It’s a lot of pressure on businesses and quality of life is not going to change much for the people on minimum wage.”

Small businesses have been hammered over the last five years by cost increases, particularly for utilities and taxes, he said. “We are fighting to stay competitive by keeping our costs down so our prices are fair to our customers.”

On Jan. 1, the impact of Bill 148 is hitting the business sector, said Matt Marchand, CEO for the Windsor-Essex Regional Chamber of Commerce.

“The chamber asked for this to be phased in over five years,” he said of the minimum wage increase. “We hoped to put everybody in a room together, say here are the objectives and what is the preferred approach to get there…. But it’s done now. We thought that might be a better approach, but the government did not do that.”

The problem is Ontario’s new labour legislation comes on the heels of cap and trade, soaring hydro rates, a serious threat to the future of the North American Free Trade Agreement and changes to the way the federal government taxes small businesses, Marchand said.

“There has been a cost and risk escalation in the past year to the entire cost structure of doing business in Ontario,” he said. “That’s why we preferred a five-year phase-in (of Bill 148). We want to have an attractive story for business in Ontario so they will invest, thrive and stay here. We don’t need to be the cheapest, but among the most competitive.”

The Ontario government has been unmoved by these complaints from the business community.

The changes provide “a minimum wage people can actually live on and modernizes our labour laws to address today’s world,” said Minister of Labour Kevin Flynn.

“Too many families struggle to get by on part-time or temporary work,” Flynn said. “Those working full time can be living in poverty. This is unacceptable in Ontario. Our plan will help ensure everyone who works hard has the chance to reach their full potential and share in Ontario’s prosperity.”

Those who will pay the price include municipal taxpayers.

The City of Windsor has included a $1-million contingency fund in its 2018 budget to deal with fallout from Bill 148, said treasurer Joe Mancina.

Smaller municipalities are expecting to be hit harder because they have a greater number of minimum wage employees and on-call workers, such as firefighters and snowplow drivers — who only work when they are needed. Those workers must now be given benefits that match those of their full-time counterparts.

“It will take us some time into 2018 to understand the full implications,” Mancina said. “The minimum wage will not be a huge impact for us that will drive up costs, but personal emergency days, holiday pay and stand-by pay will have an effect… By the time we move into 2019, there will be more clarity.”

dbattagello@postmedia.com

twitter.com/DaveBattagello

Changes to Ontario labour law on Jan.1:

— Workers are entitled to three weeks vacation after five years with the same employer.

— Like larger companies, employers with fewer than 50 workers must give them 10 personal emergency leave days a year, with at least two being paid days.

— Employers will not be allowed to request a sick note from an employee taking personal emergency leave.

— When a worker or their child is the victim of domestic or sexual violence, or threats, the worker can take up to 10 individual days and up to 15 weeks of leave.

— Unpaid leave to look after a family member is extended from eight to 28 weeks per year.

— Part-time, contract and casual workers must be paid the same hourly wage as full-time staff performing the same duties.

— Joining a union and reaching a first collective agreement will be easier.

— Under certain circumstances, employers must pay employees for three hours of work for cancelled shifts and being on call.

http://windsorstar.com/news/lo.....-wage-hike
RCO





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PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

( I find in general most businesses haven't been clear to there customers if they've raised prices or not , many people suspect some did as they seem higher but without an official notice its hard to determine
also think some feel its politically incorrect to speak up against the changes as they know the increase is popular among the lower income people , but this posts indicates some businesses have raised prices , a little caesars in Simcoe Ontario did and they posted a note on door saying so )




98.9 THE DRIVE‏Verified account @989THEDRIVE · 3h3 hours ago

REID and Ben: Minimum wage in Ontario is officially $14/hour and there's a Little Caesar's in Simcoe, ON that's responded with this note to their customers. Do you think there are more positives or negatives when it comes to the wage hike? #ygk
Toronto Centre





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PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RCO wrote:

my point is the average consumer isn't gaining anything from this policy and is in fact worse off now than they were before the change .

I don't feel any worse off now. Don't know anyone who does.

You do? Not sure why. But ok.
Quote:

the average family ( if there not minimum wage earners , either on pensions or earning more ) is going to lose money , as prices have risen at so many places , there likely losing $50 - $100 each month if you were to add up all the times they were paying more , an extra 50 cents here and a $1 there eventually ads up

Sure would love to see the math on this.

Lots of articles suggesting an increase of $0.05 or a dime on things like a hamburger and such, a muffin and the like.

Im guessing if you eat 1500 burgers a year or 750 muffins then you will suffer. Otherwise....nope.

Quote:

as to what the typical minimum wage earner spends the extra money on ? that is there decision , but with rent increases , hydro bills , credit card bills , there isn't going to be a lot extra left , anyone who thinks the economy is going to boom in 2 weeks when they start getting slightly bigger pay cheques is dreaming

So what you are saying above is that the increase in wage is a good thing since , and let me quote you here..." with rent increases , hydro bills , credit card bills , there isn't going to be a lot extra left ," so it will help them.

Thats good !
Quote:

no one really believes that convenience stores decision to eliminate late night hours was not related to the minimum wage hike , the notice went up on there door jan 1 or 2 , literally the day after the minimum wage went up and is no reasons locally for the change , other businesses in the plaza are still open and been no late night robberies here or local factors I could think of


$2.40 an hour....OMG we should close !

No one....I repeat no one believes they closed because of the wage increase. It was already on their mind to close as they just wern't cutting it with the late hours. The increase may have pushed the owner over the edge, but his thinking was already to change hours.

Dont be so gullible.

I realize that this will have an impact both ways. I understand the business owners concerns. What with electrical bills etc climbing (and should really be lowered) but I will not concern myself with their version of the sky is falling.
Toronto Centre





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PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is what I cannot stand.

The Windsor Star should point out the obvious but ok, union town .

None of this makes any sense at all.
Quote:
A sharp increase in Ontario’s minimum wage has already cost eight of Marc Kobrosli’s employees their jobs and means customers of his dry cleaning service will pay 10 per cent more, he says.

On Jan. 1, Ontario’s minimum wage will jump from $11.60 to $14 an hour. In 2019, it will go up another $1 as a result of the Fair Workplaces, Better Jobs Act (also known as Bill 148), which makes significant changes to the province’s labour laws.

Small business owners are being “thrown in the deep end” by the sudden minimum wage increase, said Kobrosli, the owner of Blondie’s Cleaners in Windsor.

A sign on the countertop at his business tells customers that a 10 per cent across-the-board price increase is solely due to Bill 148. Kobrosli also blames the legislation for his decision to lay off eight employees and close Blondie’s outlets in LaSalle and Amherstburg earlier this year.

He still has 24 full-time and seven part-time workers — most of whom make minimum wage.

“It was money I had to save in wages just for preparation of what was going to happen in January,” Kobrosli said of the staff reduction. “I closed those two locations to soften the blow.


Read his last line. It should actually read " I wanted a lot more money as the owner"

Sure dude. Your company so go right ahead.

But an increase of $2.40 an hour means he fires eight employees ?

Do the math. None of that makes sense. Eight employees costs him an extra $19 an hour. Ok, sufficient hit worthy of some action.

So what does he do? Fires them and voila, he now has an extra $93 an hour to himself.

Obviously there was enough work a month ago for those eight, and now all of a sudden there isnt?
Maybe his business is dwindling as most dry cleaners seem to be.

But the fact is he isnt being truthful with anyone and wants to blame the wage increase .

So be it.
RCO





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votes: 3
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Toronto Centre wrote:
RCO wrote:

my point is the average consumer isn't gaining anything from this policy and is in fact worse off now than they were before the change .

I don't feel any worse off now. Don't know anyone who does.

You do? Not sure why. But ok.
Quote:

the average family ( if there not minimum wage earners , either on pensions or earning more ) is going to lose money , as prices have risen at so many places , there likely losing $50 - $100 each month if you were to add up all the times they were paying more , an extra 50 cents here and a $1 there eventually ads up

Sure would love to see the math on this.

Lots of articles suggesting an increase of $0.05 or a dime on things like a hamburger and such, a muffin and the like.

Im guessing if you eat 1500 burgers a year or 750 muffins then you will suffer. Otherwise....nope.

Quote:

as to what the typical minimum wage earner spends the extra money on ? that is there decision , but with rent increases , hydro bills , credit card bills , there isn't going to be a lot extra left , anyone who thinks the economy is going to boom in 2 weeks when they start getting slightly bigger pay cheques is dreaming

So what you are saying above is that the increase in wage is a good thing since , and let me quote you here..." with rent increases , hydro bills , credit card bills , there isn't going to be a lot extra left ," so it will help them.

Thats good !
Quote:

no one really believes that convenience stores decision to eliminate late night hours was not related to the minimum wage hike , the notice went up on there door jan 1 or 2 , literally the day after the minimum wage went up and is no reasons locally for the change , other businesses in the plaza are still open and been no late night robberies here or local factors I could think of


$2.40 an hour....OMG we should close !

No one....I repeat no one believes they closed because of the wage increase. It was already on their mind to close as they just wern't cutting it with the late hours. The increase may have pushed the owner over the edge, but his thinking was already to change hours.

Dont be so gullible.

I realize that this will have an impact both ways. I understand the business owners concerns. What with electrical bills etc climbing (and should really be lowered) but I will not concern myself with their version of the sky is falling.



my math isn't scientific as to how much an average family is losing from the wage increase but if you start to assume it cost them as extra $2 or $3 to eat out at a fast food place or some grocery items cost 25 cents or 50 cents more . it doesn't take long and you'd reach my estimates over the course of a month

but whole whole point is there NOT gaining anything , what are they gaining from the fact everything costs more and every store is slower cause they now have less cashiers on duty ?

the average "working family " in Ontario is gaining nothing from this policy , absolutely nothing


I can also specifically recall being at a grocery store this summer and hearing the owner talk about this issue , he specifically said they would have to raise prices on basic items to deal with the increase .

the margins in the grocery business are already thin and they don't make a lot of money on some items , add the minimum wage increase and there whole business just got that much less economical and harder to make any sort of profit


if you want i'll ask the people who work at that convenience store why they suddenly changed there hours ? I'm sure it has something to do with the minimum wage
Toronto Centre





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PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

my math isn't scientific as to how much an average family is losing from the wage increase but if you start to assume it cost them as extra $2 or $3 to eat out at a fast food place or some grocery items cost 25 cents or 50 cents more . it doesn't take long and you'd reach my estimates over the course of a month

One would have to eat out 20-25 times a month. The people who do that are not worried in the slightest about this increase.

So no, the math does not work.

Quote:
..and every store is slower cause they now have less cashiers on duty ?

You know this how?
Bugs





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PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Notice how our low-watt Liberal avoids the inflation issue, and responds to the other as if his lack of comprehension is somehow proof that the claims are over-stated.

I live in the area, but I don't know Blondies, but imagine that the dry cleaner has site where the clothes are cleaned, and branch outlets that are used service areas remote from this main location. And an extra $100 a week per full-time employee, plus the delivery people ... it's easy to imagine a full-time and a couple of part-time employees at each location, plus a driver. Add to that one or two people let go at the main plant due to decreased load -- it's easy to see how a company would want to cut this out. With 24 full-time employees, it would add about $2300 a week to the payroll, and there's still another 7 part-times, who presumably get a couple of days work a week -- so that would add another $300 or so.

So, if you had a small business like this, and faced a $10,000 a month increase in the wage bill, what would most people do? (Not TC, but those who can count.)

And, of course, there is the carbon tax as well!

More money chasing the same number of commodities -- inflation!

Inflation is a tax on savings.

Pity the pensioners, and those on fixed incomes, because they are the ones who will end up paying for this mess.
Toronto Centre





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PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bugs wrote:
Notice how our low-watt Liberal avoids the inflation issue, and responds to the other as if his lack of comprehension is somehow proof that the claims are over-stated.

LOL!

The 'other guy' made claims he pulled out of his arse. All of it he said happened the day the new wage went into effect.

But you believe him. Ok doke.

And why is that wrong?
Quote:

I live in the area, but I don't know Blondies, but imagine that the dry cleaner has site where the clothes are cleaned, and branch outlets that are used service areas remote from this main location. And an extra $100 a week per full-time employee, plus the delivery people ... it's easy to imagine a full-time and a couple of part-time employees at each location, plus a driver. Add to that one or two people let go at the main plant due to decreased load -- it's easy to see how a company would want to cut this out. With 24 full-time employees, it would add about $2300 a week to the payroll, and there's still another 7 part-times, who presumably get a couple of days work a week -- so that would add another $300 or so.

So, if you had a small business like this, and faced a $10,000 a month increase in the wage bill, what would most people do?

Your math is horrible !

Good lord how did you make it this far being such an idiot?

For one, not all of those employees got a raise. Drivers make more than MW.
Clerks in the front of the store would.
The people running the presses and steamers would make more than MW.

Go find a 12 yr old and ask him to do the math.
Quote:

Pity the pensioners, and those on fixed incomes, because they are the ones who will end up paying for this mess.

No they wont.

Im going to pay, my neighbour is going to pay. Pretty much everyone.
Bugs





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PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a notice that employees of Tim Horton's got at a store in Cobourg Ontario on the day after Christmas.

Quote:
Dear Team Members:

It is with great regret that Ron Joyce Jr. Enterprises Ltd. (Tim Hortons) finds it necessary to make the following changes to our incentive programs, paid breaks, and policies.

These changes are due to the increase of wages to $14.00 minimum wage on January 2, 2018, then $15.00 per hour on January 1, 2019, as well as the lack of assistance and financial help from our Head Office and from the Government. The decisions of the follow are the results of intense discussions with management and numerous small business owners in the area and other franchise owners.

Breaks will no longer be paid. A 9 hour shift will be paid for 8 hours and 20 minutes; 8 hour shift will be paid 7 hours and 30 minutes; 7 hour shift will be paid 6 hours and 30 minutes; 6 hours shift will be paid 5 hours and 30 minutes; 5 hour shift will be paid 4 hours and 45 minutes; 4 hour shift will be paid 3 hours and 45 minutes; 3 hours shift will be paid 2 hours and 45 minutes.

The incentives of working your birthday and the day off with pay after six months of not calling in are cancelled.

The incentives of receiving bonus' for covering shifts when called on days off and a day of pay for a death in your immediate family will continue.

Dental and Health Benefits will continue, but members will be required to cover the cost of the benefits by the following:

Over 5 years of employment will pay 50% of the cost of their benefits.

Employees will 6 months up to 5 years will pay 75% of their benefits cost.

Any employee may cancel their benefits if they wish. Please let us know as soon as possible.

We apologize for these changes. Once the costs of the future are better know we may bring back some or all of the benefits we have had to remove. All the above will become effective January 1, 2018.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10159858891975078&set=a.305596210077.328872.896235077&type=3&theater


It illustrates another way that real businesses operate in Ontario. Hortons is reducing and eliminating benefits of its employees, which included a dental plan and upper tier medical treatments. They will probably also have to increase prices soon.
RCO





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PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

( a tim hortons franchise is trying to eliminate some benefits and such due to wage hike , although there plan may prove difficult to push thru and likely caused a lot of bad publicity which chain had been trying to avoid )



Some Tim Hortons employees to lose paid breaks and other benefits

Canada news · 2 hours ago

Employees at an Ontario Tim Hortons location say they're losing paid breaks and several other incentives as a result of the province's minimum wage hike. The location is owned by the children of the chain's founders.
Bugs





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PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
50,000 Ontarians could lose their jobs from $15 minimum wage hike, watchdog says
Shawn Jeffords, The Canadian Press
Published Tuesday, September 12, 2017 10:30AM EDT

TORONTO -- More than 50,000 people could lose their jobs if the Ontario government goes ahead with its plan to raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour by 2019, the province's financial watchdog said Tuesday in a report that assessed the economic impact of the proposed increase.

The job losses would be concentrated among teens and young adults, while the number of minimum wage workers in Ontario would increase from just over 500,000 to 1.6 million in 2019, the Financial Accountability Office said in its report. FAO chief economist David West said the province is entering "uncharted waters" with the increase because no other jurisdiction has gone so far so quickly.[Emphasis added]

While the move will have a positive impact on the province's total labour market income -- hiking it by 1.3 per cent -- it will also result in job losses over a number of years.

"There's evidence to suggest these job losses could be larger given the magnitude and rapid pace of this increase," West said.

[....]

NDP leader Andrea Horwath said the Liberal government rushed its plan without helping prepare small business. If it had started this transition years ago it could have mitigated the impact, she said.

"That's what happens when the Liberals do things for political purposes ... and (are) trying to get a bump in the polls," she said. [....]
https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/50-000-ontarians-could-lose-their-jobs-from-15-minimum-wage-hike-watchdog-says-1.3585918


This is from September, but it seems to be unfolding as they said. If they expect the minimum wage workers to increase from "... just over 500,000 to 1.6 million by 2019. That means that 1,1 miillion Ontarians will see their present wages descend to the minimum wage. How many of them will feel that they should also get another $2 or $3/hour raise? I imagine all of them!
RCO





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Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bugs wrote:
Quote:
50,000 Ontarians could lose their jobs from $15 minimum wage hike, watchdog says
Shawn Jeffords, The Canadian Press
Published Tuesday, September 12, 2017 10:30AM EDT

TORONTO -- More than 50,000 people could lose their jobs if the Ontario government goes ahead with its plan to raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour by 2019, the province's financial watchdog said Tuesday in a report that assessed the economic impact of the proposed increase.

The job losses would be concentrated among teens and young adults, while the number of minimum wage workers in Ontario would increase from just over 500,000 to 1.6 million in 2019, the Financial Accountability Office said in its report. FAO chief economist David West said the province is entering "uncharted waters" with the increase because no other jurisdiction has gone so far so quickly.[Emphasis added]

While the move will have a positive impact on the province's total labour market income -- hiking it by 1.3 per cent -- it will also result in job losses over a number of years.

"There's evidence to suggest these job losses could be larger given the magnitude and rapid pace of this increase," West said.

[....]

NDP leader Andrea Horwath said the Liberal government rushed its plan without helping prepare small business. If it had started this transition years ago it could have mitigated the impact, she said.

"That's what happens when the Liberals do things for political purposes ... and (are) trying to get a bump in the polls," she said. [....]
https://www.ctvnews.ca/business/50-000-ontarians-could-lose-their-jobs-from-15-minimum-wage-hike-watchdog-says-1.3585918


This is from September, but it seems to be unfolding as they said. If they expect the minimum wage workers to increase from "... just over 500,000 to 1.6 million by 2019. That means that 1,1 miillion Ontarians will see their present wages descend to the minimum wage. How many of them will feel that they should also get another $2 or $3/hour raise? I imagine all of them!



that's the whole problem with the way this increase was brought forward , it was done too rapidly , my understanding is it would of hit $14 an hour eventually as it was set to rise with inflation each year but they decided to speed up the process

so now we have all these workers at $14 an hour , some have been there for years and others new , the more experienced ones will surely expect more money eventually or move to another job that is willing to pay more


they showed a clip about this on the news last night , interviewed a business owner , who's strategy is to try and sell more products to keep up with the expanded payroll costs . but how many businesses are thinking the same thing ?

it makes no sense for them all to suddenly need to sell more ? the market in many places is only so big , there isn't the money or customers in some towns to suddenly increase sales to the rate needed to keep up with the wage increase .

by my calculations using a bar with 15 employees as an example , it would need to sell $200 or so dollars more in drinks every night just to pay for the higher wage , it doesn't sound like much but realistically its a difficult goal to reach , it mean the bar would have to be busier every night ( than it was before the wage hike ) and selling more drinks to maintain the same number of employees ( but every other bar is thinking the same thing so it creates an extremely competitive environment where some are eventually pushed out of the market )


the likely scenario is we see a wave of business closures and reductions in operating hours in the coming months ( not necessary the big chains but smaller mom and pop enterprises especially in smaller towns ) but then eventually things settle down once the survivors have adjusted to the higher wage
RCO





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votes: 3
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Multiple Tim Hortons franchises, other businesses cut pay, benefits, citing minimum wage hike

Ontario workers at Sunset Grill, Wimpy's and East Side Mario's say they're feeling the pinch

By Aaron Saltzman, CBC News Posted: Jan 05, 2018 5:00 AM ET| Last Updated: Jan 05, 2018 6:37 AM ET

Employees at several Tim Hortons franchises, as well as other businesses, have been told they're going to take a hit as a result of the recent increase in Ontario's minimum wage.


Employees at nearly a dozen Tim Hortons outlets across Ontario tell CBC News they are facing the loss of paid breaks, benefits, and perks by franchise owners citing Ontario's minimum wage increase.

The cuts go beyond the iconic coffee chain, with minimum wage workers at other businesses being told they're also going to take a hit as a result of the hike.
■Tim Hortons heirs cut worker benefits

Sources tell CBC News Tims franchise owners are taking similar action in Leamington and Port Hope and at multiple locations in the Cobourg area.

One family that owns six franchises in Durham Region, east of Toronto, is cutting paid breaks at its locations because of what it calls a "massive" increase in labour costs. Ontario's minimum wage rose to $14 an hour from $11.60 on Jan. 1, and it will go to $15 next year.

The details were outlined in a letter handed out to employees and obtained by CBC News.

durham-timmies-memo
Employees say this memo was sent to workers at six Tim Hortons locations in Durham Region. It says, 'Effective January 1, 2018 we will no longer be able to provide the benefit of paid breaks.' (CBC)

"I'm sure some of you have wondered that with such a dramatic increase in wages if some or many of you will be laid off or lose your job. I want to assure you we are doing everything we can to eliminate that concern," the owners wrote.

"Unfortunately when wages rise at such a fast pace we cannot raise our prices at the same rate to offset the costs and something has to give."

"Effective January 1, 2018 we will no longer be able to provide the benefit of paid breaks."

This follows revelations first reported by CBC News about actions taken by Ron Joyce Jr. and Jeri Lynn Horton-Joyce, the son and daughter respectively of Tims co-founder Ron Joyce and the late Tim Horton and the married owners of a franchise in Cobourg.


Ron Joyce Jr. Enterprises Ltd. gave staff members a letter to sign indicating that they agreed to a series of compensation changes, including eliminating paid breaks, and asking them to pay the majority of costs associated with benefits.


CBC News has been unable to reach Ron Joyce Jr. Enterprises Ltd. Employees says the principals are at their winter home in Florida.
■Premier calls Tim Hortons heir 'a bully'

A spokesperson for the Great White North Franchisee Association, which represents Canadian franchise owners who have been squabbling with Restaurant Brands International, their corporate head office, says they have been in touch with Ron Joyce Jr. and Jeri Lynn Horton-Joyce since this story broke.

"They have made it clear to me that because of RBI's statements in the past that they do not want to put themselves in jeopardy by speaking with the media," said the spokesperson, who did not want to be identified.

'Hard-working small business owners'

But in a later statement the spokesman defended Ron Joyce Jr. and Jeri Lynn Horton-Joyce. "They, like many Ontarians, are hard-working small business owners who are striving to keep their business viable and keep all of their employees employed."


The move by the two prompted a sharp response from Ontario Premier Kathleen Wynne.


"To be blunt, I think it's the act of a bully," said Wynne in an interview with CBC News.

"And if Mr. Joyce wants to pick a fight, pick that fight with me and not the people who are working at the service window of the stores."

"Tim Hortons is a really important part of daily life of millions of Canadian families. But so is having a decent living wage," she said.

The franchisee association responded that Ron Joyce Jr. and Jeri Lynn Horton-Joyce have "chosen to make a business decision based on the fiscal realities that have been thrust upon them by the premier and her government."

Tim Hortons outside in the snow
People stand outside a Tim Hortons location in downtown Toronto. Actions taken by the son and daughter of the chain's co-founders to cut employee benefits at a franchise in Cobourg are 'the act of a bully,' Ontario Premier Kathleen Wynne said. (Evan Mitsui/CBC)

Tim Hortons franchises are not the only businesses responding to the minimum wage increase by cutting in other areas.

In a thread posted on Twitter, columnist and freelance writer Andray Domise posted a copy of a document — which he shared with CBC News — outlining increases to the tip-out at Sunset Grill, a popular Ontario chain of breakfast restaurants, in the wake of the wage hike.

Servers at restaurants are often required to pay some of their tips out to other workers who don't receive gratuities.

Sunset Grill is raising the amount servers have to pay "to ensure the continuation of successful operations following the increases of minimum wage rates."


'People are very upset about it.'

— A Sunset Grill server

"Coinciding with that 20 per cent increase in minimum wage they get hit with a 25 per cent increase in their tipping clawbacks," Domise said.

It's unclear how the increased clawback on tips would offset costs.

A recorded message at Sunset Grill's head office said it was closed and no one would be available until Jan. 8.
■'Addicted to a low-wage economy'

A Sunset Grill server who asked to remain anonymous told CBC News their wage increase is now effectively nil.

"This is a big deal and it's just really about the principle of it all and how it's happening," they said.

"People are very upset about it."

"That [increase] helps with groceries. I work with one girl who supports her husband and her daughter; she's the sole earner of the household. So for some people it does mean a lot."

Servers at Wimpy's and East Side Mario's, Ontario restaurant chains, also told CBC News their tip-outs went up as of Jan. 1. In the case of East Side Mario's the server said he will be paying out 30 per cent more.

No longer salaried employees



Other businesses are making changes to employee status or benefits.

victory ford memo
A memo outlines employment changes for casual drivers at Victory Ford Lincoln Sales in Chatham, Ont. 'You will no longer be considered an employee ... but rather an Independent Contractor and will be paid as such.' (CBC)

A car dealership in Chatham, Ont., sent a memo, obtained by CBC News to its casual drivers stating, "Please be advised as of January 1, 2018 we will no longer be paying by the hour for driving services, instead we are switching to a 'Per Trip' payment."

"You will no longer be considered an employee of Victory Ford Lincoln Sales Ltd. but rather an Independent Contractor and will be paid as such."

An employee at the dealership directed inquiries to the manager, who did not immediately respond to an email seeking comment.

Other costs also increasing

At Rainbow Foods, a specialty food and supplement store with two locations in Ottawa, employees are losing two paid 10-minute coffee breaks.

"Minimum wage workers in Ontario like me are going to be retaliated against," said one employee.

Co-owner Mischa Caplan, though, told CBC News his only other choice would have been to cut staff.

"Minimum wage is part of it. The CPP increase is part of it, I think the retail environment in general is a big part of it."

"We are not trying to nickel- and-dime employees, we are trying to navigate a very challenging period. And we are doing so for the health of the business," he said.

Caplan said his business is maintaining many other employee benefits, including health and dental and paid lunch breaks.


http://www.cbc.ca/news/busines.....-1.4472878
RCO





Joined: 02 Mar 2009
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votes: 3
Location: Ontario

PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

more stories and reports about the wage increase seem to be coming in from across the province


prices are definitely going up , there is no denying that . is a small independent coffee place downtown . I sometimes buy a muffin there , yesterday it cost $1.90 . I've never paid that much for 1 muffin , think it used to cost around $1.60 a few years ago and a couple months was maybe $1.75 , so the price has been rising as the minimum wage has gone up

so if I buy 4 muffins a month that is an extra 60 cents , over the course of a year an extra $7.20

my point is I'm not gaining anything , everything is going to cost more and if I lose an extra $5 here and $7 there its going to eventually add up to a fairly large amount of money by the end of the year , all so wynne can gain some support and voters from low income minimum wage earners
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Wynne knows $15 minimum wage will kill thousands of jobs

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