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Bugs





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PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:35 pm    Post subject: Would this be a good day to talk about global warming? Reply with quote

As I write this, it's hovering around -15 C, and overnight it was -20 C. So perhaps an old fart can be forgiven for wondering about that global warming that the big thinkers have been promising us for 30 years now.

At first, I was afraid. I mean, they were talking about methane fires in the atmosphere and all that Carl Sagan type stuff. No wonder. But I soon realized -- if it's such a catastrophe, why isn't the government actually doing something about it? And I began t see that it was going to take a century ... and the consequences always seem to be getting less severe.

So I started getting used to the idea. And even look forward to it a bit. Who can deny that an extra degree or three wouldn't make all our lives a little bit better? Not that it would make it balmy in winter, but that it would make winter maybe two weeks shorter at each end of that season, and why would that be a bad thing?

So I find myself feeling let down ...

https://www.naturalnews.com/2017-12-27-remember-when-all-the-climate-change-experts-warned-that-winters-would-be-warmer-and-snowfall-would-decrease.html
Toronto Centre





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PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Would this be a good day to talk about global warming? Reply with quote

Bugs wrote:


So I find myself feeling let down ...


You should be feeling let down . I agree. By your education.

Posting that link as evidence of anything but make believe only confirms you have no education nor sleuthing skills. Stick to the economy cuz you suck at this.

For instance , should I address the author by what name? Dr. Albert Parker or his other name Alberto Boretti ?

Of course you dont know (how could you> you never looked!) that the authors have been thrown under the bus and the co-authors have admitted to making it up.

Its funny to me, and many others , how you righties (not all here, most listen and educqate themselves) get triggered over fake news yet here you are all sanctimonious about something you found and went ah ha !....proof!

Id imagine you could convince yourself the sun rises in the west with enough bogus sites you peruse.

LOL !
Progressive Tory





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PostPosted: Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe we could discuss climate change...
Bugs





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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Climate change? Doesn't "Global Warming = Climate Change"?

"Climate change" is the retreat position the environmentalists took after they could no longer sustain the fear that the world was going to imminently turn into a cinder. It was sad because they had tested it on primary school kids, and it scared the living bejesus out of them.

I think it's religion. Environmentalism, I mean. It's hard to discuss it because it's a matter of faith more than of science. It's one of those cases that the critics know more about than the protagonists do. There hasn't been any global warming for 20 years.

Quote:
LONDON, 2 October, 2017 – It is official. The world is warming according to expectations. The so-called and much debated “pause” in global warming is over. And the culprit that tried to cool the planet in spite of ever-rising levels of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere?

Blame it on the Pacific Ocean. It went into a not-so-hot phase, part of a long-term natural cycle, which has now come to an end. This explains the apparent slowdown in the rate of global warming.
https://climatenewsnetwork.net/global-warming-hiatus-over/


You'll note the exultation in the article. They have 'discovered' an increase in temperatures. Halleluiah, the warming is back! A strange reaction for what is being sold to the public as a catastrophe!

What they don't tell you is that you can't simply measure the temperature of the earth. It's different temperatures in different places. The number they are using to support their claims is a derived, constructed number. It certainly isn't a 'temperature'. It's more like the Dow Jones Index.

Anything they tell you about the history of climate change should be understood in light of this fact -- there were no instrument temperature records kept on a global basis until 1885. Anything before 1815, outside of Europe, is likely to be based on tree rings and ice core drillings. Scientists that pretend they can calculate a numerical temperature from this data are farcical. All they can do is separate the big growth years from the slow growth years. All the rest is based on assumptions, some more valid than others.

Add to that, their models don't work in the sense that they can't track our current temperatures.

During the 'hiatus' the lobby group turned to climate change and began to attribute hurricanes and other disasters to CO2 -- and stir public fears with new end-of-the-world scenarios. This is really far-fetched. There are no more hurricanes than there ever have been.

It isn't that there isn't a problem. but this so-called 'environmentalism' sucks all the oxygen out of the room -- and cash, too. Where do corporations donate? How about private people? Baby seals are probably neck-and-neck with the dispossessed of Africa in the race for private donations. There's major public will to take care of the environment, and these Green outfits suck much of that up. But they don't actually DO much if anything.

Environmental orgainzations are into using taxes, regulations, and carbon credits as ways of extracting a new financial dividend from the internal combustion engine. It doesn't get down to actually doing anything practical on the ground. Who talks about urban air quality for instance? Or cleaning up rivers? The truth is they have eliminated the possibility of the little person getting access to toxic products, through regulation of commerce. The big farmers still get the good stuff. What about the runoff? It illustrates the problem. The big economic interests get a way around the rules. That way, the public thinks its protected, but the big polluters keep the benefits.

I don't say it's all bad. I just say that the carbon tax will end up being pollution permits, and the number of permits allocated will depend on the government's need for revenue in the end. It'll be like the tax on gasoline. It started out being a tax to pay for road-building and maintenance. Hah! Now it's higher than ever, but we aren't building many miles of new road. The rest of the money is used for other things.

I say this: the burden of proof is on the environmentalists. When they have proof of the problem that stands up, and engineering for the solutions is in hand, we should be prepared to write the cheques. But we're a long way from that.

The environmentalists are acting shamefully. They try to stampede the public with fears. a lot of which they implant in the kids in the early grades of public school. They don't have practical solutions other than closing down Industry. When we came to the time their predictions should have been showing up -- according to Al Gore's movie -- they didn't. We seem to be swimming in oil. The oceans are still within their normal ebb and flow. And depopulation. Way beyond their pay grade.
Progressive Tory





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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not all places will see warmer temperatures because of climate change. Some will see cooler temperatures.

Climate change is not just the temperature we experience but also ocean temperatures.
RCO





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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

this whole thing is starting to confuse the average Canadian who had been told time after time , the planet was warming and warming to dangerous levels .

and the only solution to solve the problem was a carbon tax , now the same people who forced the carbon tax on us in Ottawa , have decided its too cold in Ottawa for new years eve events and most Canada 150 events on parliament hill have been cancelled due to weather


so yeah the whole thing is starting to confuse people , is it getting colder now ? or is it still going to warm up ? no one seems to know

just a couple weeks ago there was a major media report claiming the polar bears were headed to extinction ( after a photo of a dying bear surfaced ) although from all reports I've read there is tons of sea ice in that region this year and there not dealing with a loss of habitat as once feared
RCO





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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

( the poor cbc is forced to explain that most new years events on parliament hill have been canceled due to cold weather )


Party pooper: Extreme cold cancels some NYE events on Parliament Hill

As extreme cold continues in Ottawa, some events have been cancelled on Dec. 30 and Dec. 31

CBC News Posted: Dec 29, 2017 8:06 AM ET| Last Updated: Dec 29, 2017 2:08 PM ET

Some outdoor events in Ottawa on Dec. 30 and on New Year's Eve have been cancelled, but public skating and New Year's Eve fireworks are still on.


Some of the events planned for the New Year's Eve party on Parliament Hill in downtown Ottawa — doubling as the ceremonial end to Canada's sesquicentennial celebrations — have been cancelled due to extreme cold.

While some activities are still happening, such as public skating on the Canada 150 rink, most of the musical events have been called off. There are also some cancellations for the Saturday before New Year's Eve.

The events cancelled for New Year's Eve include:
■Hockey on the Hill
■Tim Hortons on the Hill
■Roaming Referees
■Kumpa'nia percussion show
■Rhythm Works percussion and dance show
■Algonquin language learning in a tipi
■Canada 150 closing party on the Hill
■Carl Müren and Evana Müren concert
■DJ Shub concert
■Kardinal Offishall concert

The events cancelled for Dec. 30 include:
■Hockey on the Hill
■Tim Hortons on the Hill
■Roaming Referees
■Kumpa'nia percussion show
■Rhythm Works percussion and dance show
■Algonquin language learning in a tipi

Public skating on the Hill, the tipi illumination and the winter lightscape shows, including the Christmas Lights Across Canada display, are still happening on both days. Fireworks planned for New Year's Eve on the Hill at midnight will also go ahead as scheduled.

Daddy-daughter duo disappointed

Carl Müren and his daughter Evana were scheduled to preform Sunday night.

The duo DJs together and were to take the stage in front of the New Year's Eve crowd on Parliament Hill.

But the weather has frozen them out as well.

Carl and Evana Müren
Daddy-daughter DJ duo, Carl and Evana Müren were scheduled to preform on the Hill on New Year's Eve. Now they are making alternative plans. (CBC News)

"It was going to be special. Something that would bond us for the rest of our lives." said Carl Müren.

He said they are not sure what their plans are going to be for New Year's Eve at this point, but he suspects many people are disappointed.

"I think right now everybody is trying to have some super event to go out to," he said. "It's so Canadian, the fact that it's cancelled due to weather."

Dress warmly to avoid frostbite

Organizers are asking spectators to take the cold weather into account when preparing for the weekend's festivities. Visitors are advised to dress warmly to prevent frostbite and other potential injuries.

A cold spell descended on the region earlier this week. A high of –19 C is expected Saturday with the wind chill making it feel more like –30 C. On Sunday the high is expected to be –20 C, with an overnight low of –24 C.

The norm for this time of year is between –6 C and –14 C, according to Environment Canada.

Temperatures are expected to warm up early next week.


http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/.....-1.4467186
Bugs





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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Progressive Tory wrote:
Not all places will see warmer temperatures because of climate change. Some will see cooler temperatures.

Climate change is not just the temperature we experience but also ocean temperatures.


I'd like to see how you derive that from the CO2 hypothesis. How does warming cause cooling? As I understand it, the climate is, in fact, a thirty year running average of the weather. That's what climatologists deal with. Long-term averages of millimeters of rain, temperatures, wind velocity. first frost dates, stuff like that.

I think what you are alluding to is the difficulty in getting those numbers for the whole surface of earth, including the oceans, at one time. It's impossible, so they derive a number. I compared its relationship to the actual global temperature to the Dow Jones Index in relation to actual economic performance. I think that's apt.

The fact is that the IPCC made predictions which Al Gore publicized in his movie, An Inconvenient Truth. Those were supposedly expert opinions. This is just one.

Quote:
An Inconvenient Truth exaggerated sea level rise
By Roger Highfield, Science Editor7:15PM BST 04 Sep 2008

Al Gore's Oscar-winning environmental documentary exaggerated the likely effects of global warming on sea levels, a new study shows.

The film, An Inconvenient Truth, suggested that the sea would rise up to 20ft "in the near future" as the ice in Greenland or Western Antarctica melts.

Other documentaries have picture Britain deluged with water, showing the House of Commons submerged.

However, while some mainstream predictions project sea levels 2 to 4 meters higher by 2100, a new study published today in Science concludes that a rise in sea level between 0.8 and 2 meters is much more likely. [....]
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/new.....-rise.html


This shows the actual rate of rise of the oceans.

Quote:
... When averaged over all of the world’s oceans, absolute sea level has risen at an average rate of 0.06 inches per year from 1880 to 2013 (see Figure 1). Since 1993, however, average sea level has risen at a rate of 0.11 to 0.14 inches per year—roughly twice as fast as the long-term trend.
https://www.epa.gov/climate-indicators/climate-change-indicators-sea-level


At that rate, it might increase a foot in a century. Not exactly as alarming as they made it sound, is it?

I know it's hard to believe that the makers of this film could get a Nobel for it ... and yet it be so full of baloney. But it's true. The film dramatizes the predictions of the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, supposedly written by the leading experts in the world. And virtually every prediction about our times has turned out to be wrong.

The fact is that these environmental sharpies have allied with various other global interests to panic populations in the west into opening huge flows of capital into their favoured fields. The expert's predictions misfired, and in Science, that means the theory is rejected.

But this isn't Science. It's religion.
Bugs





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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From twitter: a weather map showing how much of North America is below freezing ...

https://twitter.com/RyanMaue/status/947569743338311680

h/t smalldeadanimals ...

People who believe in the CO2 thesis as a matter of faith ought to recognize that while some locations might be cooler than last year, it should be balanced by other areas of comparable size that are hot. Or hotter than usual to the same degree that the whole of North America is experiencing colder temperatures. They should off-set each other.

And where would that hot place be?

The CO2 thesis says that CO2 traps heat in our atmosphere, and the danger is that that this heat will keep rising until the planet becomes inhospitable to life. True, it can still be cool in one place if it is proportionately hotter somewhere else, but the total amount of heat has to keep rising. Otherwise, there are other factors involved. Like ... the sun?
Bugs





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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Progressive Tory wrote:
Not all places will see warmer temperatures because of climate change. Some will see cooler temperatures.

Climate change is not just the temperature we experience but also ocean temperatures.


Following up on this theme, Prog ...

This article has scientists comparing predictions Gore has made before with his current justifications. Here is the point -- Al Gore is disaster-marketing's first billionaire, and no doubt he knows that fear is the best motivator for a sale. But the problem is what he predicted before. A hint about the science: Karl Popper says if a hypothesis isn't refutable, it isn't science.

Quote:
Al Gore: ‘Bitter cold’ is ‘exactly what we should expect from the climate crisis
By: Marc Morano - Climate DepotJanuary 4, 2018 10:07 PM with 0 comments

Former Vice President Al Gore has weighed in on the record cold and snow in the U.S. “It’s bitter cold in parts of the US, but climate scientist Dr. Michael Mann explains that’s exactly what we should expect from the climate crisis,” Gore wrote on January 4 on Twitter.

Gore linked to one of his organizations’ articles on the brutal winter weather written by Climategate professor Michael Mann: The Climate Reality Project: A ‘PERFECT STORM’: EXTREME WINTER WEATHER, BITTER COLD, AND CLIMATE CHANGE

In the Gore touted article, Mann linked the cold and “lots of snow” to “climate change.”


Gore’s Oscar-winning documentary An Inconvenient Truth did not warn of record cold and increasing snowfalls as a consequence of man-made global warming. And as recently as 2009, Gore was hyping the lack of snow as evidence for man-made global warming. Source: “Gore Reports Snow and Ice Across the World Vanishing Quickly.”

Other climate activists warned of less cold and snow as well.

Flashback 2000: ‘Snowfalls are now just a thing of the past’ – ‘Children just aren’t going to know what snow is’ – UK Independent

But as the snow piled up, the climate change claims were adjusted and cold and snow were added to the list of things caused by “global warming.” See: Warmists Wheel Out “Record Cold Due To Global Warming” Argument Again

In 2010, Gore claimed “increased heavy snowfalls are completely consistent with… man-made global warming.”

Predictions of less snow and less severe winters were hammered into the public by global warming scientists. But once that predictions failed to come true, the opposite of what they predicted instead became—what they expected.

If “climate change” is causing record cold and snow, then it would stand to reason that Gore is suggesting that if the U.S. had ratified the UN’s Kyoto Protocol treaty on “global warming” back in the 1990’s — the winter of 2018 would have been warmer?

Reality Check: But scientists are not buying the claims of Gore and Mann and others linking the record cold and snow to “global warming.”

‘Insanity…It’s Witchcraft’ – Meteorologist Joe Bastardi on claims that cold & snow caused by ‘global warming’ – WeatherBell Meteorologist Joe Bastardi on January 4, 2018: “This is flat out insanity and deception now To tell the public that events that have occurred countless times before with no climate change attribution, is now just that, is not science, its witchcraft. NO PROOF AT ALL. Its climate ambulance chasing, nothing more.”

Bastardi added: “This has happened countless times before and it wasn’t global warming then and is not now. Solid use of past patterns predicted major early cold from OCTOBER! I have tweeted that dozens of times showing the analog years I used, No co2 then.”

Climatologist Dr. Roger Pielke Sr. also weighed in, explaining: “For those who claim USA/Canada nor’easter is stronger because of ‘global warming’, they apparently do not realize that it’s so strong because of especially strong horizontal temperature gradient in troposphere. It ‘bombed’ because of usually cold air!”

Update: Global Warming Is Not Causing Harsh Winter Weather – Daily Caller – Excerpts: Kevin Trenberth, a scientist with the National Center for Atmospheric Research, said “winter storms are a manifestation of winter, not climate change.” …

“Such claims make no sense and are inconsistent with observations and the best science,” University of Washington climatologist Cliff Mass said of claims made by Mann and others. “The frequency of cold waves have decreased during the past fifty years, not increased. That alone shows that such claims are baseless.” “And on a personal note, it is very disappointing that members of my profession are making such obviously bogus claims,” Mass said. “It hurts the science, it hurts the credibility of climate scientists, and weakens our ability to be taken seriously by society.” …

Every winter seems to reignite the global warming debate. Things got intense in 2014 when former White House science czar John Holdren put out a video where he claimed that year’s “polar vortex” was actually a sign of global warming. Holdren’s video was largely based on research by Rutgers University scientist Jennifer Francis, which claims that warming in the Arctic is making the jet stream more wobbly, making cold snaps and nor’easter storms more frequent. Holdren later admitted that his video was based on his “personal opinion” of the science, but the argument is still used every time cold Arctic air pours down through the lower 48 states.

Mann wrote that global warming may be “causing the jet stream to meander in a particular pattern” that causes cold spells in the eastern U.S. Mann suggested this pattern was being driven by “the dramatic loss of sea ice in the Arctic.” Yet, scientists aren’t sold on this theory. Mass noted how theoretical research shows the opposite happening, future warming would drive less undulation in the jet stream and heat up the area responsible for cold spells in the U.S. “Research documented in peer-reviewed journals has demonstrated that there is no evidence for their claims of increasing frequency of ‘lazy jet streams’ and blocking over time,” Mass said. “If you substantially warm the source region of cold air, cold waves will decline,” Mass said. A 2014 study led by Colorado State University climate scientist Elizabeth Barnes found no evidence to back up the theory that a lazy or wobbling jet stream was becoming more frequent. “There is much disagreement on whether we have already witnessed substantial impacts,” Barnes wrote in a Thursday blog post for the Climate Variability and Predictability program. …

Climatologist Judith Curry said the “bomb cyclone” currently hammering North America is nothing new. Those extra-tropical storms have undergone “bombogenesis,” or rapid intensification. “The term ‘bomb’ for such storms was coined almost 40 years ago by MIT’s Fred Sanders,” Curry told TheDCNF, “who spent much of his career studying such storms back when global warming most definitely was not a factor.” …

Curry said that while “warmer oceans can cause greater snowfall,” storm intensity is also influenced ” by the patterns of sea surface temperature not so much the average temperatures.” But Mann’s arguments are more based on expectations of what could happen with more warming, and have little to do with current trends in “bomb cyclones.” Weather.us meteorologist Ryan Maue, an expert on cyclones, pointed out there are between 50 and 60 “bomb cyclones” every year in the Northern Hemisphere, many of which we don’t notice because they are too far out at sea. But Maue’s research on “bomb cyclones” also don’t show any discernible trends from 1979 to 2010.
http://www.climatedepot.com/20.....te-crisis/
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